Calvary Today: AGM of Shame

Saturday, June 20, 2009

AGM of Shame

Unwanted Senior Pastor Prince clings on unashamedly.

Deacon Patrick Wong gets the boot.

Kangaroo AGM at Calvary.

Pas Ronnie Chin, the unconstitutional Chairman.

No closure to Calvary saga. Division and strife continues.....

The AGM of 19th June 2009 (which ended on 20th June 2009) was the darkest day in the history of Calvary Church. It was a day the basic constitutional right of members was thrown out the window. It was a day truth and transparency in God’s house were blatantly obliterated and members’ feelings and concerns were treated like trash. It was a day the sheep were badly abused by their very own shepherd instead of being cared for. It was a day our God was mocked!

The AGM saw Senior Pastor Prince Guneratnam unashamedly clinging on for dear life by hiding behind the ‘skirt’ of the Church Constitution, aided by his faithful deacons and friends from the AG Council.

The AG representatives, Pas Ronnie Chin (AG Malaysia Asst General Superintendent and ex-Calvarite) who acted as the Resolutions Chairman and Pas Kelly Yap (close buddy of our Pas Peter) are obviously not independent due to their close ties with SP and Pas Peter. This situation reminds us very much of the Kangaroo Court that was formed by the Deacons to try Dr Lum not too long ago. Only this time, both the AG representatives together with SP and the Deacons, use the very same Constitution of the members and interpreted it to their advantage, to victimize the members.

Of the 7 resolutions proposed by the concerned members, only the one on the voting process by way of secret ballot was tabled and overwhelmingly approved by the members. All the other 6 resolutions were thrown out on technical grounds.

Pas Ronnie and Pas Kelly were obviously just puppets on the string. Pas Ronnie played the bad guy as the Resolutions Chairman and rejected all the resolutions based on the flimsiest of reasons provided by the Board of Deacons. They found fault with the most insignificant of wordings used in the resolutions and ignored the basic rights of the members. It is shocking that Pas Ronnie can proclaim that the Board of Deacons can overrule the entire body of members who elected the Deacons in the first place. All over the world, the Board of Directors (Deacons) are answerable to the shareholders (members). In Calvary, it is the opposite. Pas Ronnie and the Deacons were more interested in the Letter of the Law than the spirit of the Law.

The Church Constitution clearly states that full powers of administration rest with the members at a general meeting but this basic constitutional rule was totally disregarded. Yet, in the same breath, they claim that they are abiding by the Constitution. Their behaviour was not unlike the Pharisees in Jesus' time.

The most important resolution of the AGM which is the ratification of SP’s Re-appointment was one of the earliest to be thrown out on technical grounds. Had this resolution been put to the vote, SP would have been sent packing. The sentiments of the members and atmosphere of the AGM were clear evidences that SP is no longer wanted and that many members have lost all confidence in him. Any respectable pastor with a little bit of self-worth would have stepped down immediately.

In the rejection of the resolution seeking the intervention of the General Council of the Assemblies of God Malaysia to manage our Church, Deacon Philip Tan lied through his teeth and told the AGM that there was no basis for the resolution because there is no problem, no strife, no division in Calvary and everything is fine.

The resolution to close the 4 internet blogs was tabled and approved by the members. This resolution should not have been allowed to be tabled on the basis that the blogs do not belong to the Church and therefore, the members have no locus standi to vote on this matter. However, Pas Ronnie allowed the resolution to be tabled. From this, we can see the inconsistency of Pas Ronnie’s judgment or rather, his obedience to SP.

The 2nd similar resolution on the closing of the internet blogs was withdrawn by the proposer. The controversial resolution calling for the review/termination of voting members who are not contributing to the church was also withdrawn by the proposer.

The AGM ended at about 12.15am and was adjourned to the following day at 3.00pm. The adjourned meeting finally ended at 8.30pm on Saturday night. This 10.5 hours of meeting will go down in Calvary's history as the longest AGM in her 48 years of existence.

The AGM was very much marred by the conduct of Pas Ronnie. His behaviour as the Resolutions Chairman was very unprofessional and despite being booed by frustrated members, he was adamant on playing his role of being SP's saviour. On the first night, he kept on making unnecessary long-winded comments and remarks and encouraging unnecessary debate, all with the clear intention of prolonging the proceedings and getting the AGM adjourned. Even after the members voted to continue the meeting until after all the resolutions proposed have been dealt with, he kept badgering the members to propose an adjournment. If this is the new breed of shepherds and leaders our AG Council endorses, then the future of the Assemblies of God in Malaysia is dead.

RESULTS AT A GLANCE.

This is a summary of the Results of the Resolutions submitted for Tabling at the AGM.

1. Proposed amendment to Church Constitution RULE XII: FINANCIAL PROVISIONS, Item 3a, 3b and 3c on appointment of external auditors. (Result: PASSED by members)

2. Proposal that all resolutions of this AGM be voted on by secret ballot. (Result: PASSED by members)

3. Proposal that one of the Associate Pastors of the Church be appointed for the purposes of chairing this AGM.
(Result: REJECTED BY THE BOD)

4. Proposal for the intervention of the General Council of the Assemblies of God Malaysia to manage our Church until the Church is capable of managing its own affairs.
(Result: REJECTED BY THE BOD)

5. Ratification of Senior Pastor’s Re-appointment.
(Result: REJECTED BY THE BOD)

6. Closure of CalvaryToday, Berita Calvary, Calvary Kini and Calvary Unity.
(Result: PASSED by members)

7. 2nd Proposal for Closure of the same 4 internet blogs.
(Result: Withdrawn by the Proposer)

8. Resolution on Review of membership rolls.
(Result: Withdrawn by the Proposer)

9. Proposal for a new Constitutional Review Committee.
(Result: REJECTED BY THE BOD)

10. Proposal for setting up of a Truth Committee.
(Result: REJECTED BY THE BOD)

11. Removal of Dr Lum from Church membership to be declared null and void. (Result: REJECTED BY THE BOD)
A member asked Deacon Philip Tan if the BOD thinks that Dr Lum has "departed from the tenets of faith" and Philip Tan said, "YES". Philip Tan and the BOD have effectively passed a "spiritual death" judgment on Dr Lum.

DEACONS ELECTED
1. Ngeow Zoo Gin (new)
2. Wong Ming Yook (new)
3. Bernadette Foo (re-elected)
4. David Peter (new)

AUDITORS ELECTED
1. Tam Kok Meng (re-elected)
2. Chow Sang Hoe (re-elected)

Footnote:

At the re-commencement of the AGM on Saturday , one member lodged an official complaint on the flawed balloting process. During the balloting of the resolutions in the previous night, there were witnesses that some voting members had more than one ballot slip and a few non-voting members were seen holding ballot slips. When a few members ask for additional ballot slips, they were freely given. None of the ballot slips were numbered. The ballot results are therefore, inaccurate and cannot be accepted.
Pas Ronnie rejected the complaint on the basis that it was out of order and advised that the member can raise it again before the next ballot. As it turned out, there was not going to be another ballot because Pas Ronnie subsequently rejected all the following resolutions on technical grounds.
It is now so apparent that right from the onset, Pas Ronnie knew that all the following resolutions will be rejected and therefore, his rejection of the official complaint on the flawed balloting was a pre-meditated move to defraud the members.

This opens the door for any unhappy member to file a complaint to AG Council against Pas Ronnie for unscriptural conduct. It also allows any member to get a court order to declare the entire AGM null and void.

=============================================

NOTICE TO MEMBERS

CalvaryToday had previously resolved that it will not close the blog and will continue to exist to expose the unscriptural conduct, unethical practices and wrong-doings of SP, the Pastors and Deacons until such time, truth, transparency, good governance and righteousness are restored in Calvary Church.

Berita Calvary will continue to publish Christian-based articles, testimonies and teachings which will edify and bless the body of Christ and propagate the gospel to the world.

130 comments:

BB said...: Well done to all who voted for truth,transparency and good governance. It is rather strange that there was no recount by the chairperson when the votes were 278 for having scrutiners and 279 against the resolution. Thus, the reliability of the ballot votes for the rest of the resolutions can be questionable. Furthermore, the ballot papers were not numbered and this could cause manipulation of votes. Overall, the secret balloting was badly carried out.
Why should the blog be closed when the real issues of truth, transparency, and good governance are not resolved?
Was it true that the Church Constitution was amended in 2004 concerning no retirement age the senior pastor without the approval of the congregation? If that is the case, then the 2004 amendment may be invalid!Hope the proposal to establish the constitutional review committee through the ballot be carried out today.; June 20, 2009 at 8:30 AM
the sheep now confused said...: Can someone tell me what is the role of the chairman?
i am confused. this chairman seemed to debate on behalf of the members
instead of managing the meeting.he instigate for new motions when decision has been voted for. i thought this has to be proposed by the floor members. resolution should be put to vote and not debated upon.let the opinion be put into vote rather than debated as there is so much time constraints and emotion involved. those who are in favor just vote for and majority decides.

i have been in so many corporate meetings and have yet to see a chairman who talks and argue more than the members or even debate on behalf of one party.
or could it be this is new rule and usual corporate rule don apply??? please help me understand.; June 20, 2009 at 8:50 AM
Member said...: Based on the responses from yesterday nite AGM, SP had lost his support. He should quickly resign before God 'remove' him. Perhaps the resolution for ractification was not passed for a reason. God wants him to resign voluntarily? or SP wants to wait for God to act?

One brother really God sent, he had so much wisdom.. true, close all blogs, more new blogs will surface...; June 20, 2009 at 9:38 AM
Long Live CalvaryToday said...: Irrespective of the vote, don't let blindness to dictate the path of truth. Keep the blog. As for the other church-sponsored blogs, leave it to them. Don't fall into their ploy.

Standing for truth is a long standing battle. If you vote for blog to stay, give your comment here in the blog.

Your say in the church AGM is blocked. Ps Ronnie Chin as Chairman is no difference as they are all in the boat.; June 20, 2009 at 10:07 AM
Member said...: To : Pastor Peter

You mentioned that you and other pastors are called by God to full time ministry and and its a calling, and you faced the temptation to quit the ministry, Can I know..

1. It is God calling or you are calling yourself?

2. It is your personal opinion or from all pastors?

3. Can I know when are you going to retire since you are now so tired of your ministry?

4. You too have reached age 60, why still stay on?; June 20, 2009 at 10:30 AM
lets go private said...: So, Majority have voted the blogs to be closed down. I am one of them.

Karl has made a good illustration on why it should be done.

I suggest, taking things privately, be it private forum on the church website or private blog.; June 20, 2009 at 10:31 AM
Member said...: To: Pastor Ronnie Chin

Yesterday night was my first time seeing your true face and true color and hearing, it is very disappointing to see how high handed and cunning your approach is, God is still in control anyway, I heard of you but never know who you are until yesterday night, I felt so ashame to have such a Chairman for the AGM, where is your Christian approach as a Chairman? Why are you proposing similar motions for so many times as a Chairman? Dont you think you have violated the constitutional rules of proposing the motion as Chair? why are members being 'instigated' by your repeated, stumbling repetition of your statetment?? EG. Joseph. Why are you so biased to allow some member to talk for so long? eg. Pastor Peter?

Pastor Ronnie, I heard that your church members and acquaintance also quite 'cheesed off' with you, Is it true?

Can some lawyers please let us know, whether this part of the AGM is valid?; June 20, 2009 at 10:43 AM
God is God and we are not said...: hey, come on lah, don't continue to point point here, point point there. Last night's meeting was far better than expected already. There were no unruly behaviour. Screaming and shouting and anger were put to a minimum.. we should all be happy already..

Let's just praise God that the meeting was a smooth one. This afternoon will be even better...; June 20, 2009 at 10:57 AM
the sheep said...: I feel sorry for- you Ps Steven. I have the most respect for you. But you have to remember,- you are how people see u. if the feedback- hurts, then u need to seriously reflect, otherwise you shouldn,t be at all affected.
By asking the blogsite to be discontinue is to go into denial. just like an ostrich who choose to bury its head in the sand.
I hope all those who proposed blog closure are wiser than ostrich.
Please bear in mind, there are nore than CT blog that is talking about Calvary. Google-in and u will see. So how many blogsite are u goin to close??

Solve the issues and the blog will ceased to be relevant eventually.

Otherwise expect more hits whether in CT, CK or others.; June 20, 2009 at 11:06 AM
Can we afford not to have Calvary Today said...: A sister pointed out that the blog was established because of the discovery of abuse of power of the Senior Pastor and the Board of Deacons and their desire to sweep things under the rug. Yes, he is the root cause(with a supporting cast) of CC's promotion of disunity suspicion etc bringing about the birth of the blog, Calvary Today. If there are some Calvarites still in denial, there's nothing much one can do about that. I wonder why he/she not listening to the official direction of deacon HJK to stay away from access and participation in blogging.

Without the disclosure in Calvary Today all the abuses of power, of position and discriminatory practices will not be given attention. In schools there are school bullies. Better believe this, in churches there are.....

Look at the pages in the bi-monthly Calvary Newsletters, any space given to discuss members' issues. Just go over all the old old issues and quote an instance.
Now go to the church website as well to satisfy my statement.

Consider the conduct and proceedings of all past AGMs and the glossing over of major decisions. Another brother or sister has already commented abt the proceedings last night.

Just ponder for a moment by asking yourself a question why no other similar blogs exist for other churches in Malaysia. Do not assume we have nothing better to do after a hectic day in the office.

In a nutshell, the question to ask is not whether Calvary Today should be shut down but can you afford not to have a source for the exchange of serious matters affecting our spiritual lives and proper use of church funds putting an emphasis on transparency accountability and Godly governance.; June 20, 2009 at 11:59 AM
Member said...: ' Adoi...' in bahasa. The fact that SP cannot chaired the meeting yesterday night for the resolutions is a very clear sign that, the members had lost trust and confidence in him, other than the 'bunch' of die hard BOD who supported him.

Pastor Ronnie Chin repeated called for resolutions to be deferred for today at 3pm appeared to be pre-planned. I saw the same group of people and the same hands of these supporter raising for adjournment to today for the first round of voting and second round of voting really puzzled me, how could this be a co-incidence when they vote for the first round and second round to adjourn? Whereas Pastor Ronnie is so focus to have the 3 remaining resolutions adjouned for almost the whole night... If he is not interested to take up the responsibility of chairing the AGM for yesterday night, then he should have offered it to someone else.. Shame on you Pastor Ronnie.; June 20, 2009 at 12:13 PM
Voter said...: I heard from one brother who mentioned at the AGM that, he would rather trust the Court of law than the deacons for the 'Statutory declaration' by Dr Lum with regards to SP ractification at the board meeting in year 2004, Now the quetion is : how dare the board are fabricating this yesterday night instead of allowing the members to vote for SP ractification?? Truly, I too prefer to believe in Dr Lum Statutory Declaration than the board.; June 20, 2009 at 12:24 PM
Confused said...: last night, PG and BOD had to use man-made constitutions to defend themselves and we the members, however valid our reasons and proposals, were turned down and shut off using legalistic reasons. The leadership of this church has forgotten that God-ordained principles should come first and not some silly bias constitution created by man. If Prince Guneratnam doesn't even have the confidence that he will get two thirds of his members to vote for him to continue to be senior pastor of calvary, it's high time he realizes that his current position as senior pastor is not God-ordained but merely man-made. How can a senior pastor be thick skinned enough to continue leading a church whereby half of its members no longer trust him?
As for Peter Ong saying that PG's role as senior pastor is a calling and not just a job, he should then ask himself why is it then that other pastors in the church are still subject to the staff handbook? Don't tell me only PG has a calling and not the other pastors? Since full time workers (not just pastors) are also called to be in that role, then I suggest let's just do away with the retirement age for ALL staff in the church. Let everyone work till they die. That's more fair. Why should only PG get this privilege???; June 20, 2009 at 12:24 PM
absentee said...: sadly, quite many of us are not able to attend today's continued meeting as we have prior appointments etc. it is the leadership's cunning tactics to drag on the meeting yesterday so that many ppl cannot attend the 2nd part of the meeting and vote on what matters.; June 20, 2009 at 12:31 PM
Member said...: Why close the blog? looks like Calvarites needed the CT even more now...yesterday night AGM had confirmed once again that, without the blog, no where else can the concerned members express their grievances and concerns. Even the outsider --the Chairman also not willing to allow the voting members to express their concern at the AGM, what more the Associate Members? the Chairman--Ronnie Chin denied the member to speak up, he either interrupted them and have the microphone switch off. eg. Brother Sam Ho was cut off by Rev. Ronnie Chin and the microphone..So, Calvarites.. please vote wisely.; June 20, 2009 at 12:33 PM
gagged said...: So the Church has now passed a gag order on members.

This has inadvertently invite new blogs to be setup. Concerned parties need a platform to post comments, share their opinions and highlight issues which are of interest to concerned people.

Someone, being a third party, who is not a voting member nor an associate member can setup a blog and name it as "...calvary" or "calvary...". The word calvary is not exclusive and cannot be claimed by any party as exclusive. Better if the blog owner has no ties with the church, so there will be little restriction. It can more or less be no holds barred. However those who blog must act responsibly. Subject matter published must not be racial in nature, not vulgar, not abusive nor contravenes any laws of the country.; June 20, 2009 at 1:41 PM
Church members are not stupid said...: You get what you pay for I suppose and in this case, we are not paying for Ronnie Chin's services so he expressed so many times, he was getting tired. Maybe that was the signal to have Tam Kok Ming to propose the adjournment.

The whole AGM was a cleverly orchastrated show again. Chairman keep asking for debate from the floor, "NOW FOR...NOW AGAINST" back and forth. I thought our own pastors think that we members are stupid. After last night, all the AG pastors seems to think that church members are stupid and do not know our rights and our church constitution. No point for us to argue, our Heavenly Father saw every act and heard every word that was said in His house last night by all these "anointed" ones.

In fact, Ronnie Chin himself played the stupid fool so many times when he kept asking for clarification from members as to what was said. It was so obvious that he was delaying the process and agitating the members to get angry. But the Spirit of Lord was there and members were so patient, especially Joseph Gerard who has to explain his point so many times to our Assistant General Superintendant of the AG Council of Malaysia. Such an embarassment for the AG Council to send a representative who can't understand simple english from the floor and he says he knows how to interpret our church constitution.; June 20, 2009 at 1:52 PM
no confidence said...: Prince Guneratnam is now officially the unanointed, man (BOD)-ordained senior pastor of calvary church which has lost the trust of his sheep and does not even have confidence to ratify his reappointment.; June 20, 2009 at 2:02 PM
pro constitutional change said...: it was made known that the employment terms and conditions (incl retirement age) of SP is not governed by the staff manual. where can we find employment terms and conditions service of SP? in the light of all these abuse of power, we must vote for the constitutional change resolution!; June 20, 2009 at 2:04 PM
Anonymous said...: Pshn

AREAS OF CONCERN

I am not so concern about resolutions blocked by the BOD thru’ the constitution. The credibility of both is eroding. PT and the rest can always be removed next year.

Of concern is meek support for CT which has been a source of inspiration to many. We need to find out why?

Eventually it is the congregational vote that is going to decide.; June 20, 2009 at 3:01 PM
Ex-Calvarite said...: Well, I for one, am glad that Pastor Ronnie Chin's true colours have surfaced in the AGM!

I suspect that one of the reasons why these A/G pastors support or BACK UP each other is because they are probably all guilty of the same sins, i.e covetuousness, lying, pride,deception, manipulation! They want to hide behind each other's skirts!

Shame on you, Pastor Ronnie Chin! I wonder what you are going to say when you stand before the Judge of all the Earth one day? Do you think you can twist and turn the facts as you did yesterday, and probably today too?; June 20, 2009 at 3:15 PM
Don't feel feel in church said...: To Church members are not stupid,

The pastors also not stupid - just good actors. The possible scenario is, Ronnie Chin being ex-calvarite and sat under PG1's ministry before, sent to Bible school with Calvary's missions fund must speak like PG1 and also for PG1. Our PG1 knows this, clever as he is in manipulating, would have requested specifically for him and Kelly Yap would be PO's request.

Or no one else want to do this "dirty" job so send one with poor english understanding so when he say wrong thing can just blame on his lack the command of the language. You see members, they also not stupid.

The stupid ones are actually us members who trust the pastors too much especially with our money. CT say, "Both Pas Kelly and he were more interested in the Letter of the Law rather than the spirit of the Law. Members' concerns and feelings were immaterial and completely ignored." Try writing one million cheque to them and see they will listen to you or not?

2.; June 20, 2009 at 6:46 PM
Something Stinks! said...: Prince Guneratnam has lost his credibility, and yet he hangs on for dear life to his position to the church - why? Because he and his family members are all enjoying their big,fat salaries - without having to work much for it!!

For an example, Jim Guneratnam has been in charge of Calvary Communications for YEARS, or rather, he OWNS it, but look at the poor quality videos & CDs that he has produced!! Another example, Petrina Guneratnam just spends her 'working hours' in the church office playing with her graqndchildren & she is paid RM15,000 per month with 3 months' bonus!

Church funds are really been siphoned off, in more ways than one! And look at their Extended Ministries' surplus cash!! The Guneratnams are living it up, at the expense of church members' hard-earned offerings.

No wonder PG1 fights so hard to keep hinself & his family on the roll!

And those defending and supporting them (e.g. the APS and the BOD and the pro-Guneratnam clique)are in cahoots with them - they have ALL lost their credibility!; June 20, 2009 at 7:15 PM
Fight On said...: Don't be discouraged, dear warriors for truth, righteousness & transparency. We may have lost a battle or two, but we have not lost the war! 'Cos, ultimately, the battle is not ours but the Lord's! When the Lion of Judah roars, the wicked shepherds will shake in their booties!; June 20, 2009 at 9:53 PM
Anonymous said...: Dear Calvarites, I urge you to all trust God and the battle for truth, transparency and good Godly governance is the Lord. Let us refrain from carnal remarks that cause hurt and further friction amongst one another. Join me in prayer for the cleansing of the church and revival to come. SP and the BOD may think they have won the battle this round.. but they have all have lost the war. The winning of hearts and minds on the majority of the member (yes he will have some die hard loyalists) but never mind, let's not condemn them but to pray and love them that they will see the light.

Remember to pray for the day of healing, reconcilation and God's anointing power to flow again in Calvary Church. All Glory And Praise Be to God.

Please remember we all all members of the Body of Christ..; June 20, 2009 at 10:19 PM
how to be a billionaire said...: it was disgusting to see how arrogant Prince Guneratnam still was at today's meeting. the person who said he was our 'beloved pastor' must be either living in a parallel universe or has been blinded. Prince Guneratnam does not love any of his church members, he is only in this for himself and for his family...to siphon as much funds from the church as possible. by the time his cronies realize the truth, Prince Guneratnam and family would be multi billionaires and will run off to USA.; June 20, 2009 at 10:24 PM
Fight On said...: I mean,"When the Lion of Judah roars, the wicked shepherds will shake in their [DESIGNER/BRANDED] booties!"; June 20, 2009 at 10:35 PM
Bamboo Conspiracy said...: BE STILL & KNOW THAT I AM GOD.

I have heard the news but will not respond. It is best to wait on the Lord for His guidance and divine intervention. All I want to say is in intercession, there is something called the principle of 'life out of death' - "The glory and the credit for victory in this war must come to the Holy Spirit and not to man” (Rees Howells Intercessor).

Indeed, based on this principle - the AGM - did not and could not resolve the crisis within Calvary. Neither could the AOG - as expected. Now the Lord must intervene. In the Old Testament, in spite of the initial nine plagues, pharaoh refused to let the people of God free. It was the final plague - the death of the first born that finally set God's people free. God’s final weapon to deliver His people was deliverance through “the death of the first born."

Furthermore, study Judges 20. The strange plot of Judges 20 demonstrates the mystery of God’s ways in some situations. The real battle is in the heavenlies!

NEVERTHELESS - I am disappointed with the AOG! Very deeply disappointed! Yet, all that has happened is within His purposes. I shall write more later, but for now, suffice to say, I believe the Lord has enlarged His purposes for His will in Malaysia. Not only is He going to shake churches with rogue Christian leaders, but also National Christian Organizations that have acted irresponsibly. Hence, the time has come not only to intercede for the leadership in churches but also those in National Christian Organizations.

I am checking if there is any way of escalating the issue to the AOG (www.ag.org/).

You can also watch a video clip of the birth of the AOG and its core values at:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhMBmoOBx58

Here is some background information obtained from the internet:

http://www.rckl.com.my/web/about/the-people-rckl/

Vijay

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Rev Ronnie Chin began work with Rev. Lawrence Koo, in the quaint village of Ulu Klang in 1978, sent out by Calvary Church and under the mentoring of Rev Prince Guneratnam. Needless to say he faced some challenging tasks ahead. But he had a burning passion to see people saved, discipled and equipped for the ministry.

By God’s grace and empowerment, Revival Centre grew from a handful of families and teenagers to a congregation of over 400 today. He is a graduate from the Bible College of Malaya and holds a Bachelor of Arts in Biblical Studies from the Far-East Advanced School of Theology. Pastor Ronnie is an articulate preacher and teacher of God’s Word, with the ability to clearly expound on spiritual truth and wisdom.

He is often admired as one of the longest serving pastors in a church – 30 years and counting! But he himself considers it a privilege, thanking God for the personal growth that he has experienced and for the joy of seeing the church mature.

Rev Ronnie has recently been elected as the Assistant Superintendent of the Assemblies of God Churches in Malaysia and continues to be a blessing to the church at large.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++; June 20, 2009 at 11:10 PM
Anonymous said...: Pshn

WHY?

“Why?” would be a VERY pertinent question right at this moment?
I could think of a number of issues for us to think and pray about.

1) More people need to know the truth. Currently there is a slight majority who do. If there had been an immediate change of leadership, nearly 50% will leave, some for other churches, some will even leave the faith. God loves these sheep too. We must explain more to these people. Have seminars on issues concerning the Church Handbook, the constitution, rules of running meetings, laws on CBT, how to read and understand reports esp. financial reports. Not just the accountants but all the simple grass-root people must understand and be convinced. We cannot expect them to believe us. We must help know and believe themselves.

2) Psa 103:8 The LORD is merciful and gracious, slow to anger, and plenteous in mercy. This attribute of God is always extended to us and we know how to appreciate it. However, the same is also available to PG, his dynasty and his cohorts of BOD and Associate Pastors. They have done good work for the Lord some time before. I can’t accept what they are doing now.
But overall, how would God judge their work?

3) It is most exasperating; I feel the same frustration. But it is in this very trying environment that fruits of the Spirit can really develop like love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, meekness, temperance Gal 5:22,22. These attributes are what form the real essence of Christianity. Like the irritation of a grain of sand that forms the nodus around which the oyster lays the pearl. No sand, no pearl of great worth. Yes, it is God’s time for all of us to grow a little more depth in our Christian faith so that God can use us even more for His kingdom. That’s what I want in my heart. I want Him to use me more....much, much more.

4) Anyway, to me, it is a slight setback. Like a round in boxing when you were knocked down but, hallelua, not knocked out. We get a good cleanup at the corner and get back into the ring for the rest of the match.....to win.

5) It’s good....to know exactly what we are up against with regards to the constitution, the BOD (PT) and the AOG Council people. One key to victory is to know your opponent. The VI rugby team, many years Selangor Champs in the fifties and sixties, use to have this strategy. First we will try to break through the opponent’s weakest defense, failing which we will attack through their strongest defence. The moral – keep attacking.

6) I am happy that Tan Sri Khoo Kay Peng turned up for the AGM, if only to let the incumbents should know where he stands with regards to the CC saga. I know for a fact that he is waiting for a new team of leaders to be put in place before he extends help to Calvary Church again.

7) We need a strong intercessory prayer team.

8) If there is no change in the attitude of the leaders then it is a matter of time before they are removed. We just need to CONTINUE to do want we can. Don’t let up. Don’t give them a rest.

9) Do you know God does not expect us to do more that we are able? Take Peter walking on water in Mat 14:28, 29 Then Peter spoke up. "Lord, if it is really you, order me to come out on the water to you”. “Come!" answered Jesus. So Peter got out of the boat and started walking on the water to Jesus.

First, Peter had to get the PERMISSION from Jesus. Then in he WALKED (a thing which he does everyday). But he had to walk on to the sea (which required much FAITH). But it was also over a stormy sea (This required even MORE FAITH) But THE MIRACLE, which was totally due to Jesus, was Jesus suspending the law of gravity below Peter’s feet.

10) So, brothers and sisters, WE MUST persevere and do want we CAN DO according to the gifts (natural &/or spiritual) God has given us and LEAVE THE MIRACLE TO GOD!

GOD BLESS. When is the next EGM/ AGM???; June 20, 2009 at 11:15 PM
Member said...: wow..its historical moment for calvary church, in my entire life, this AGM totalled 10-11 hours. Calvary church...worse off than any organisation on earth from this day on... you need a 10+ hrs AGM??

PG1 , I weep for you, Ronnie Chin, I too weep for you. are you sure, both of you are Christians? I am now very puzzled..

Dr Lum, I salute you.. Philip Tan I too weep for you, you had officially delcared at this AGM that Dr Lum departed from the 'Tenets of faith'. We demand the apology from BOD, PG1 and Ronnie Chin to publish open apology in all newspaper in Malaysia to Dr Lum.

A Brother concerned members who went out to ask question abt the Indonesia earthquake fund and requested that his statement be recorded in the minutes and also do not pass this minute as he mentioned that he was being interviewed by "POLICE" pertaining to this money transfer. Secretary Bernadette and Edward, please take note, your minuting will decide whether you have any element of involving in this fund transfer. PG1, save yourself, all recording and transcript are in the hands of the members, you cannot run so easily this time.; June 20, 2009 at 11:19 PM
ONE MORE MOVE said...: The DARKEST HOUR in the church history of Malaysia if not the world wide world-- The Oppressive & Draconian ways of Prince Gurnaratnam and his gang of BOD & Ass, Pas.

Conscience is dead in all of them. I saw, truthfully their faces were of evil continence.

One would just flee in seeing any of them.; June 20, 2009 at 11:33 PM
SOUND BITES said...: What more is needed to prove this a Money, Power & Greedy crazy processed men who runs CC. This was what was proudly announced by the Missions Director of his Missions plan ( para phased):

' When you think of missions work in India, one would think of going to the poor into the villages.. we have a surprise for you, we are building a church to reach the HIGHER STRATA of SOCIETY!....'

No doubt, the rich Bollywood or the equivalent is sure a good target , and definitely fits in their Target Audience( membership) profile. Just think how much these can give $$$ to fufill their "VISIONS"; June 20, 2009 at 11:48 PM
Suey Yi Tong said...: I was told that PG will get his favourite soup for his Father's Day dinner tomorrow - "suey yi tong" i.e. tortoise soup 'cos the "tortoise" in the BOD has just been booted out & cooked.

Only problem for PG is that he might just choked on it as PW has been in the BOD since 1980 &, at almost 30 years old, he is thus an old & tough tortoise.; June 21, 2009 at 12:04 AM
MORTAR & BRICK said...: Going by the 'PRE QUALIFIED" requirements to get into CALVARYLAND, it is never meant for the sick, the destitute, the poor,the disadvantaged which it had declared in its lofty missions & purpose.

The 'Pastor' in-charge speak of stringent health check, (disease free) secured guarantor, etc.. and it's the place for residents to enjoy a high quality and comfortable stay...

What a contrast to what every member had given to understand ( again mislead:(( ) a 10 acre home feeding hundreds if not a thousand ( after all it's a 10 ACRE property!) to at least be a mix of Mother Theresa's work and Monfort's Boys Home. Alas, it's like a RESORT in the outskirts ( or 'Jungle' as She exaggerated)

Then, there she went about mouthing the now known signature sales pitch of PG found on every Extended Ministries Mission statement and any programme they "PIONEER": i.e. '...of reaching and evangelising to the lost, blah, blah.."

Well, for decades this sale pitch has been very effective for congregation to give & give & give until it hurts, so why not!; June 21, 2009 at 12:10 AM
sickness said...: it's time the old tortoise (ex-BOD) and his proud wife (the one handling calvaryland and failing miserably to even grow it but yet sounds so arrogant when she talked today) both leave the church..they are like what cancer is like to a body, slowly eating away the church's principles and feeding the sickness (PG).; June 21, 2009 at 12:21 AM
Anonymous said...: AGAIN THE CHRISTIANS HAVE TO LEARN FROM THE SECULAR

The Chairman’s position should only be held by someone neutral.
Ronnie Chin has such close links with PG. Even if RC was invited, he as a Christian who should be fair to both sides, should have chosen not to take the role. And what was Kelly Yap doing there when he is so closely linked with PO? I am amazed at the quality of Christians in the AOG Council. Nothing to talk about really.; June 21, 2009 at 12:29 AM
Anonymous said...: The Board of Deacons had underestimated that by using the constitution to prevent the tabling of proposed resolutions, they are actually putting the final nail to the coffin.
Many of us had hoped that the BOD would come up with amicable solutions to address pertinent issues.
It is sad that this chance for the BOD to do so went down with appalled as absolutely no consideration to mend the divide was shown.
In so doing, their credibility was lost.; June 21, 2009 at 12:52 AM
Anonymous said...: Pshn

AS I SEE IT

It is not they have won a round.
They are just prolonging the ending.; June 21, 2009 at 1:09 AM
God is watching you, PG said...: At the Aug 08 EGM (aka the Guynes EGM), PG was caught controlling the Chairman (Guynes) by remote control when PG would signal the "T" (Time Out) sign to Guynes to cut short the person at the microphone.

It was also noted that PG would stroke his hair or touch his ears & then the AV man would cut off the person who was then speaking by switching off the microphone.

Having been thus exposed, this time PG used Ps Kelly Yap (PO's fishing buddy) who sat in between PG & Ps Ronnie Chin (PG's ex-protege at CC) as a shield when PG would pretend to stretch his arms behind KY but actually PG is reaching out to touch RC to signal to him to cut short the questioning, etc.

PG, PG .... remember what the CC members cannot see, He can see.

God is watching you,
God is watching you.....; June 21, 2009 at 1:12 AM
ABC said...: Friends of CT, TGG

I just feel led to encourage you to read this Psalm which ministered to me during these 2 dark days of CC AGM

A Psalm of David
Psalms 37

The Spirit of the Lord within us will never be defeated...the wicked will only thrive for a season!!; June 21, 2009 at 1:30 AM
WWJD ??? said...: It was noted that at one point on Saturday night, Ps Ronnie Chin (as the Chairman then) was so biased that someone just couldn't tahan and shouted out "BIAS" which caught RC in mid-sentence & he stopped speaking for a couple of minutes. RC's flow of thought was stumbled & he then allowed the vote to be taken instead of giving the AGM more "crap" with his snide & uncalled for comments.

RC, RC .... where is your impartiality as a Chairman & they say that you are teaching "Robert Rules" at BCM; like that there will be more PGs & RCs amongst the future breed of Pastors from BCM.

Looks like there will be an Exodus from AG churches soon.

All AG Pastors (in reading) should rise up in ONE ACCORD & take the AG Council to task as the antics of PG & RC at the CC's AGM has brought disrepute to all AG churches. Failure to do so would be seen by all Christians as tantamount to the fact that all AG pastors & churches are actually condoning PG's & RC's antics; if so, is it still worth it to stay in AG churches?

Christians, ask yourselves WWJD (What Would Jesus Do)?

Moses said to Pharoah "let my people go"; I say to you "just walk out on all AG churches UNTIL & UNLESS the AG pastors & CHURCHES can show us that they DO NOT stand for PG's & RC's nonsense which has brought disrepute to the AG churches".

PG2 may have stated that she doesn't know what is "CBT" but I am sure all AG pastors & churches are not so "naive" that they haven't heard of "peer policing" so if you, AG pastors & churches DO NOT deal with your rougue PGs & RCs, you will also suffer the same reprove that God wants to mete to PG & RC as He says "Enough is Enough!"; June 21, 2009 at 1:32 AM
BUKIT AMAN said...: Unfortunately, it was one of the last questions to be asked on Saturday evening (when most members had left the AGM) but it had exposed the pitance that CC is giving to Missions & Evangelism.

This brother managed to get the Treasurer (ER) to confirm that the RM 200,000 which was given to CIM from the Missions Fund in 2007 was parked under the RM 260,208 which was given out to Missions & Evangelism.

This would mean that, after deducting the RM 200,000 to CIM, CC had ONLY given out RM 60,208 in 2007 or RM 5,017 per month (a pitance) to Missions & Evangelism.

The total Faith Promise collections received for 2007 was RM 4,378,040 which translates to RM 364,836 per month & this was much higher than the monthly Missions budget for Faith Promise of RM 200,000+. And YET, for all that was contributed sacrificially by CC members, we could ONLY give RM 5,017 per month to Missions & Evangelism, is this the BEST that a BIG church can do to fulfil the GREAT Commission?

Can CC truly called itself a BIG church? A Fountain Head church for that matter.

NO !!! Not when the Senior Pastor of CC can quietly siphon RM 200,000 annually from the Missions Funds to his personal ministry (CIM) over the last 5 years & when discovered, PG conscripted his loyal band of BOD to abet his act of CBT by even spending church funds (contributed sacrificially by CC members, including widows & those in the low income bracket) to engage criminal lawyer & forensic accountant to camouflage that "all is well".

Actually, the lawyer and the accountant were hoodwinked (by PG & BOD) into checking for CBT in the recipient's (CIM's) accounts when every right thinking person will know that if there is any conflict of interest (since PG is the SP of CC & CIM is his personal ministry) leading to CBT, it would have been committed in the giver's (Missions Funds) accounts.

Now that it is revealed that a police report has been made, looks like not only PG but the BOD (plus PG's sidekick, PO) has to face the grilling from the polis.

The BOD had LIED to the Aug 08 AGM by saying that the transfers to CIM were minuted. Actually they had fabricated the minutes, 'cos the Missions Manual states very clearly that PO, upon clearance by PG (& PG alone), can move the Missions Funds. The Missions Committee is only there as advisory to PO & worst still, the BOD has no say at all (as the Missions Manual states so) and the BOD had abdicated their custodial responsibility to PG & his sidekick, PO.

BOD, you better watch out,
you better watch out,
now the polis is coming to you....

The saving grace for CC is that actually it IS a Fountain Head church but a Fountain Head church for Truth, Transparency & Godly Governance (TTG). Thanks to PG's & BOD's misdeeds which has caused Him to raise up the TTG members to stand up for Him.

All Glory to God & God alone; not to PG, BOD or even the TTG members. God has used the ugliness in CC to show the beauty in the efforts to restore TTG in the church. All Praise to Him !!!; June 21, 2009 at 2:28 AM
MINUTES CAN BE FABRICATED said...: PROVEN...Minutes can be fabricated. Few members rightly pointed out that in page 9 of the 2008 Annual Report Mr Wong Kian Kheong did not say what was minuted under the heading: VII LAWYER'S REPORT. They gave the Secretary the transcript to prove it.

WOW. If AGM minutes can be fabricated, then BOD and Mission Committee minutes can be fabricated too!!!

No wonder DR Lum said the 200K a year to CIM was not discussed in BOD meetings but minutes can be 'produced'. No wonder Sam said he could not recall the 200K a year transfer but minutes can be 'produced'; June 21, 2009 at 6:46 AM
English Professor's Minuting said...: BOD Secretary can omit (WORDS IN CAPITAL) where necessary:

In pg 18 of Calvary Church Annual Report under IV.AUDITORS CLARIFICATION ON SPECIAL AUDIT:

2. Overseas airfares for SENIOR PASTOR'S grandchild and son of a Deacon (PW)

3. Scholarship FOR SENIOR PASTOR'S CHILDREN to study in the United States

4. Medical expenses RM40,000 for SENIOR PASTOR'S grandchild soon after birth

5. RM15,000 for SENIOR PASTOR's membership fees at the Jackie Chan's California Fitness gym

6. No declaration of monies received BY SENIOR PASTOR from local and overseas ministries

9. Appraisals, salary and increments of SENIOR PASTOR'S children and spouses not known to Board of Deacons

PS. Some believe Secretary who is an English Professor wrote them but PG (always has the FINAL SAY in everything in Calvary Church) chose to delete so that he and his family look squeeky clean.; June 21, 2009 at 7:08 AM
ACCOUNTABLE ALL THE MORE said...: CalvaryLand costs close to RM 10M but have only 6 residents despite 3years of operation. It costs some 0.5M a year operating expenses.

That is the type of Princely Stewardship. Big modern day hypocrite!

Yet, SP1 and SP2 claimed it was God's vision given to them as a 21st century Vision for Mission. Now, the Assistant Pastor in charge spoke of it as a great ministry...6 people in a 10m spatial homes in a jungle where you spend 70K a year on security because there are snakes and where you spend 120K a year for salaries (why? more than 10 people over 24 hrs to take care of 6)

SP1, SP2 and BOD must be held accountable! (They must be held accountable too for the CCC project - 122M needed just to complete the auditorium for use. The rest are shelf and core. 122M will incur loan 35M on the land and 41M from mortgage or sale of existing 53M properties); June 21, 2009 at 7:29 AM
Hypocrisy of the Highest Order said...: What does the membership category means in CC today?

In the just concluded AGM on a marathon scale of 10-11 hours, PG and Ronnie Chin in their house rules said:

1. Associate members cannot speak on voting resolutions because 'speaking itself is like voting because it influence voting..what a crap? This rule is just arbitrarily used to silence a no. of associate members who are ready to speak' NOW Associate members have become DISSOCIATED MEMBERS

Voting members have become 'UNVOTABLE MEMBERS'. Why? Ronnie Chin and Philip Tan (representing BOD) ruled that 5 out of 7 resolutions by TTG cannot be tabled..much against the Constitution. Voting resolutions can turn out to be Unvotable because BOD is all supreme and CC Constitution is all final...doesn't matter if the Bible is set aside...doesn't matter if Christianity is set aside...the letter of the law in the Constitution and the power of positions (Senior Pastor and Deacons) are supreme!; June 21, 2009 at 7:49 AM
CONNECT said...: RETIREMENT & STAFF HAND BOOK: 2ND EDITION

Going by the Staff Hand book, MRS PG, a.k.a SERIOR Associate pastor, why is she still around? She is 3 years 'senior' (In AGE) to her beloved, so that makes her 66 yrs, and the Terms in the handbook should apply.

Then again, maybe not, BOD has discover ANOTHER "DISCONNECT", and she hangs in there all the same.

There must be yet another STAFF HANDBOOK for Senior Assoc Pastor) (Now drafting, but rest assured, it's dated 2003, APPROVED by BOD, in its ever ready 'Template' Resolution )

Nah, but maybe not, She could be 'conveniently' parked along SP, because:
1. It has been caught many times in print (CC
publications & overseas web site) she is passed
off together as "Senior PastorS.
2. CC's( oops, it's PG's) Constitution is 'silent' on this position ( so, the all powerful BOD can "INTERPRET' however, whichever way they like.

p/s TTG is so kind..always showing them where the 'LOOP HOLES" are for them to do a neat cover-up.( Think PG & GANG love TTG for it, in secret!); June 21, 2009 at 7:52 AM
AG fails; AUTHORITY steps in said...: Hi Calvarites

1. Is it true IRB is investigating PG?

2. Is it true POLICE is investigating PG?; June 21, 2009 at 7:53 AM
I- Report. said...: A SUMMARY of Mother of all AGMs:
(no wonder nicknamed by PG 'fountainhead church')

1. PG is UNTOUCHABLE

2. BOD is SUPREME

3.ASS. pastors are PARROTS

4. members are Pawns

5. ALL rules in their INTERPRETATION.

In Conclusion:
Calvary Church KL, Malaysia, under its internationally renown Tan Sri PG, is at dead end.; June 21, 2009 at 8:06 AM
CalvaryToday - The Believer's Conscience said...: Glad to hear that CalvaryToday and Berita Calvary will still around after 22 June 2009.

CalvaryKini and CalvaryUnity all the while were church leaders-sponsored to force CalvaryToday and Berita Clavary to close down.

They failed. Now they used someone like Aaron to use resolution.

CT is relevant and important to expose the misdeeds of Christian leaders in CC so that Jesus and His Church will not be adulterated. (It will well serve to wake up other churches and Christian leaders in Malaysia so that they remain as servants and instruments of God)

Jesus is God Almighty, Son of God, King of Kings, Lord of Lords, Holy, Righteous, Alpha & Omega, The I AM, The Way, The TRUTH and The Life, The Bridegroom

The Church is the Kingdom, The Bride - radiant, stainless, wrinkleless, unblemished, holy and blameless.

Long Live CT for you are defender of Jesus and His Church

Long Live believers who stand for Truth, Transparencies and Godly-Governance (TTG)for His glory; June 21, 2009 at 8:15 AM
The Truth About AOG Malaysia said...: The AGM has exposed the ugliness of pastors of the Assemblies of God who, by virtue of their long-standing positions in the Council and have acquired high-sounding titles in the process, have come to regard themselves as God (or next-to-God)! They break rules, tell lies without blinking an eye, manipulate financial accounts, and falsify minutes of BOD meetings, bully those who dare to speakup for truth and trnsparency, and use strong-arm tactics to 'cling on to' their lucrative business of pastoring, enjoy what money can buy by living the lifestyle of the 'rich and famous,' preach the Word but do not practice the Word, etc.

Shudder! Satan has taken control of their minds and they are not complaining....they enjoy serving the devil but pretneding tobe 'God's servants.' There is no fear of God anymore in their speech, in their ocnduct, in their ministry, & in their lives! I can imagine what is going to happen to them on Judgment Day!!

Honestly speaking, I am quite ashamed of being part of the Assemblies of God in Malaysia - its name should be changed to Assemblies of Men-Who-Think_They-Are-God in Malaysia!!

What a scame! What a disgraceful exhibition of 'flesh' in the church!; June 21, 2009 at 9:24 AM
New Deaons First Duty said...: Hi New Deacons

Please be bold to cut the salaries of all Pastors (incl SP, SP1)by 50%.
Reasons:

1. They should be retired from their positions upon reaching age 60
2. Their KPI is poor
3. Other staffs reaching age 55 retire authomatically. They can be 'reemployed'by contract but 'start your pay all over again from the bottom'.
4. They treated others unkindly. They treated them as 'Kings'.
5. Please conduct investigation into the salaries, benefits and allowances of PG1, PG2, Jim, Pam and Chris. Then report to members in next AGM!; June 21, 2009 at 9:43 AM
Senior member said...: Calvary church constitution belongs to Prince guneratnam alone. He patented it for his own use. For power, status, wealth and control.

The constitution alone will cause every member to lose every single right including any suggestion and proposal for the good governance of the church

I came to calvary church not to be controlled by the constitution but unfortunately, a simple person like me who knows nothing about constitution had suddenly learned so much abt this subject in calvary church the last 2 days-- the AGM. It saddened me to know that we as a christian came to church to be controlled by our senior pastor instead of being set free of all our transgression.

I thought that when Jesus forgive our sins, and when we becoame a Christian, we go to church to worship and fellowship but little did I realized that , in Calvary church, there is such strong oppression and it is worse than my the company that I am working with.

All resolution throw out just using one word--unconstitutional.

I am utterly shocked as I looked into the proposer and seconder of the 7 resolutions submitted by the various people, they are people with qualification and experience in the social secular circle and yet they were all so being undermined by the Chairman and BOD. Calvary church had even now gone to the extent to undermind all voting members and associate members, no right to vote even for resolution and worse, associate member cannot even speak and vote. they are only allow to give "MONEY". right now, I felt that all associate should dissociate themselves from calvary church, because you are only allow to give MONEY but not talking and voting. Whereas, voting members, you are only allow to 'voice and give money.; June 21, 2009 at 9:57 AM
AGM attended said...: True, police investigating now, I heard from one member who stood up and mentioned that during the AGM on Saturday afternoon.; June 21, 2009 at 10:04 AM
A G M said...: The recently concluded AGM was just .....

A nother
G ory
M oment

in CC's shameful history.

What we do for the Lord brings Glory to His Name but what PG & his cohorts (BOD & APs, plus now cronies from AG Council like RC, KY & others hidden in the closet, not to mention Guynes) did at the AGM can be best described at GORY as they have dropped off the "L" (which stands for the Lord) from their lives.

PG & Cohorts are NO longer anointed; if at all they are disjointed from the Lord or as PT said they are DISCONNECTed from the Lord. They no longer serve the Lord, they are now serving another god - Mammon. They can be bought for USD 10,000 & RM X0,000s.; June 21, 2009 at 10:39 AM
Definition said...: Leadership in CC is ROTTEN to the CORE; June 21, 2009 at 12:50 PM
AIN'T NO FOOL said...: ARM-CHAIR SP

Did you hear PG repeatedly said.."We are not your EMPLOYER???

Obviously, he & Gang are not! aren't they "Servants of God and men? Serious problem, that he doesn't even know his true "Calling'

And he has the audacity to ask, "why don't YOU *volunteer to serve' ( of course it could only mean -- for his personal CIM and his selected Extended Ministries) while he sits in the armchair, legs raised -directing!

*( he has been using ALL the resources, including staff of the church for his CIM--so, one can supposed these staff also serve as 'Volunteers' --Brilliant!)

No chance to get to the microphone to ask, so ask here( Thank God for CT):
Q. Isn't he, PG Sr, PG2, PG Junior, PG3 ( Pam Guneratnam getting paid indecent $tipend$ totaling RM1,000,000 and all they do is walk-about giving orders, jet setting to Conferences & Meetings, and check the Bank Account$-- Private, CC, CCC, Missions +Selected Cash cow Extended Ministries ?

Calling Volunteers to serve the EMPIRE of GUNERATNAM, anyone?
( No allowances but the 'TIP$' should be good, perhaps a scholarship for your kid from Missions Funds); June 21, 2009 at 1:37 PM
PICTURE THIS said...: SMUG POSE

What a sight on 'display':
PG, leaning way back on his seat, arms spread across --one on Sec and the other the Co-chair, ( his legs.. almost raised! if not for his momentarily sense returned back to earth) and his head tilted and a smug grin on his bored face with a scornful look( probably wondering why he was found among battered sheep, in such a 'pitiful' state)

Actually the battered but brave sheep noticed, and wondered at the same time, how on earth did this wolf in sheep's clothing landed among them?

Calling KLC (from CK): who said he would video-taped the scenes at AGM, can he pose this "winning" shot of the PG here, please. Thank you.; June 21, 2009 at 1:58 PM
REALLY? said...: " IT"S ONLY YOUR OPINION" so said PG, each time daring members confront him with Truth to his face.

Who can blame him for this belief of his--after all he
has succeeded in creating a Closed-up World that revolves around him, the mighty SP of Calvary Church Damansara, KL, M'sia. Proof? :

- Congregation are told (discouraged if not warned)
not to get involve or participate in any activity or
programme of other Christian Fraternity, which are
not 'endorsed or approved ' by PG

- Staff and all who served in any capacity of
"leadership" are banned from reading CT. ( Sacking
or be 'cold storaged' hangs over their head, and it is
certainly not a threat--many already made victims!)

- Sign a "COVENANT"( how more deeper fear can they
instill) to pledge 100% allegiance to them ( including
the 'frightened' youths) before one can serve in the
ministry headed by Pam G!

- ALl Assoc pas. & BOD brainwashed, they no longer
have the ability to discern even the Word of God from
that of PG's self-made commandments.

Suggestion: Can CT run a Poll or the BOD commission a Quantitative Survey within and without by professional Research Co to conduct this. ( This is more worthwhile to be paid from the church funds than the RM28,372 fees paid to white-wash the transfer of monies btw Missions & CIM); June 21, 2009 at 2:37 PM
SCANNER said...: TRUE or FALSE?

Did you notice under pg22 of Annual Report, an item for"LEGAL & PROFESSIONAL FEES: RM28,372"

Q. The lawyer declared at the EGM that he has decided to waive his fees. so, why is there legal fee incurred?

It's sure not a case of what is heard,said, or/and saw is what will be accounted for or Minuted.. ACCURATELY.

Members now have to be on high alert for a lot of hidden items, half-truths, omissions & additions in from Sunday 'speeches' ( can't be called God's message), to write-up to announcements to correspondence to Minutes, to manuals,etc, etc.

An INDEPENDENT WATCHDOG is absolutely needed
since Truth Committee Resolution is 'Barred' from being tabled!; June 21, 2009 at 3:02 PM
Weeping Ass. Pastors said...: Yes, I agree with a CT blogger the CT blog letting the cat out of the basket too often.

I contributed to it as well. No weeping and frequent-criers this time but we witnessed more stern-faced ass. pastors acting as "social-escorts" escorting pro-concerned members' group's speakers to and from "mike" or stopping them short. Calvary Church is full of new acts and surprises which have clearly demonstrated a total lack of faith love and respect of its congregation and faces they are familiar with. Amazing...; June 21, 2009 at 3:11 PM
I prefer ginseng soup said...: Hello 'Suey Yi Tong'

I wondered this 'soup' is tasting any better? I believe this 'soup' from the many meaty part of the 'outthrown' BOD should be sufficient to serve all who 'slaughter' him..hahaha...

But as it goes, I prefer ginseng and chicken soup because of the marathon AGM on both day.; June 21, 2009 at 3:13 PM
CC's OSCAR said...: "Chairman of the Year" goes to Pas.Ronnie Chin
Runner-up: PG.

To beat PG for this coveted Award in CC is really a feat! ( but both of them can celebrate, since RC is a product of PG's mentoring).

Kudos! to Joseph Gerard, who stood boldly and declared his displeasure over the Chairman's conduct on the proceedings and asked it to be Minuted, as well as to pin-point the section that the Reso must be put to vote by members.

Kudos! to Roland who also challenged the Chairman to show 'Proof' where in the Constitution BOD has the right to stop the accepted RESO submitted in compliance from being voted upon, and pointed out that the Chairman has acted outside of his role by ruling & deciding on which Reso can or cannot be tabled!

To both of these challenges, the Chairman's reply were incomprehensible. Matter of fact he had no answer and turned for help, and it was readily at hand in the form of the DP (A Deacon nominee) who was positioned to seat row one for such purpose. So, he certainly did his part to justify PG's approval of his candidacy! (+a pat on the back from PG); June 21, 2009 at 3:43 PM
retirement said...: Dear Connect,

that's a good point abt the Staff Handbook 2nd ed. many of us don't realised that Mrs PG has passed retirement age. how come she is still around? isn't she bound by the staff manual also?; June 21, 2009 at 4:16 PM
haha said...: the good news in the resolution to close blogs being approved is that the satanic blogs - CU and CK will have to be closed coz if they don't, church leadership will take serious disciplinary actions on the administrators (who are probably existing crony leaders in the church). As for CT and BT, keep on doing the work that God has placed u to do. We do not need to fear church leadership taking action on you all as you are only accountable to God and not to the bunch of no good pastors and BOD. So, keep up the good work and we will all still keep coming to CT and BT to read on the latest updates and will also fwd to all our friends all over the world to expose the lies of PG and his family.; June 21, 2009 at 4:25 PM
pride comes before a big big fall said...: yeah, Pg said arrogantly 'we are not yr employer' but yet when concerned members asked questions yesterday, he will rudely boss them around by ordering them to 'speak to the chair' when these brothers and sisters were already speaking to the chair. Prince Guneratnam, we are all SICK of your arrogance and unholiness and pride and deceit. Enough is enough!; June 21, 2009 at 4:28 PM
TTG Supporter said...: I was shocked to hear SK say during yesterday's AGM that the 2 ministries owned by PG's children actually have deficit funds as it is an outright lie. In the income statements of CCM and CLM, 2 of their biggest expenses were actually non cash items, ie. depreciation. In actual fact, if you deduct the depreciation expenses from their income statement, they actually have cash surpluses, so by SK saying that these 2 ministries still have to raise money themselves (fund raising) to cover up for the deficit in their accounts are blatant lies as in reality, there is no deficit. The 2 ministries have more than enough cash surpluses but yet they still need Missions funds to be channeled to them. Shocking and totally unacceptable. SK, we have lost respect for you.; June 21, 2009 at 4:35 PM
Crisis after crisis said...: If only the AOG has "nipped" it in the bud when the problem was first brought to the council's attention more than a year ago. I wonder why no action was taken when concerned members brought it to AOG's attention then? RC & partner participation at the meeting is with or without the endorsement of the AOG council?

Character comes before charisma is a pre-requisite. Church leadership is about integrity and God-fearing people; qualities that can eliminate problems and build confidence.

A church has to involve the majority of its membership(better still all) in any fund-raising and church building project. Just half a dozen deacons and the Senior Paster's vision alone is not enough as proven in the case of Calvaryland. Now the proposal to raise more funds in order to complete the CCC project (mind you with a large part as core and shell only) is another bad mistake.

How to achieve it? Here're the proposals stated by HJK at tail-end of the AGM.

(a)sell properties valued at abt RM52 million
(b)sell and lease back
(c)go back to bank to raise more mortgages on the properties.

Simple solution!!; June 21, 2009 at 5:10 PM
OPEN FILE said...: A new case for investigation: Calvary Kindergarten

Treasurer Edward Rajasingam said at his presentation that the "write-off of Unrecovered Receiveable" of RM 126,000, was for unpaid rental due from Calvary Kindergarten.

This item done at the advice of Auditors, who saw it *'hanging' out there uncomfortably, and that it be cleared out *( sorry,I'm not an accountant so 'terminologies' used are not of the profession)

A few questions were asked-- which has prompted a closer-look at this matter as it seems there is more to it than meet the eyes.

ER's reply at the AGM (in brackets, are what I wish to comment and ask in the light of his reply):
1.YES, it was an EXTENDED MINISTRY
( Shouldn't it's Accounts be Shown? ( even
though it is now defunct))

2.-he believed it was established in the 90's
( but I remembered my child attended there in the 80's. Can the church confirm the year it was formed,please?)

- the Kindergarten was closed in 2003.
( wasn't it closed earlier, again can the church confirm, please?)

3. Not sure if the Closure of the Kindergarten was
ever Officially announced and told to the
Congregation at the point in time.

(I for one didn't know about it, nor those I have asked sometime ago. However, it was said the closure was 'Sudden' and that the teaching staff were shocked by it, as they were informed it was closed for 'renovation' initially. According to one part-time teacher then, the parting of ways were not pleasant if not acrimonious.

Sis.Petrina had during a Missionette's occasion or the kindergarten's graduation ceremony said it was such an effective ministry as it was opened to all races and it had good enrollment too, and at times had to be wait listed. It was doing very well.

What actually happened that it was closed so abruptly? and run to the ground so quickly?

Who headed this Extended Ministry?
Was it registered in the church name or the trustee, or personnel's name?

Can we request for a Full Report on it's final closing accounts and what actually led to the demise of this Extended Ministry?

Also, helpful to know from those involved and affected, to share their experience?; June 21, 2009 at 5:16 PM
Reader said...: A Warning to all newly elected deacons and all associate pastors and auditors, as SP and BOD is in the hands of the police investigation, please beware that if you ever attempt to help sp in anyway to hide or alter any facts in any documents or minuting; perhaps you may end up in hot-soup, especially to the young lawyer--david, beware that your legal practice licence may just....; June 21, 2009 at 5:51 PM
Associate Member said...: The excuse will be 'SK is not an accountant by profession....'. As such, he does not know how to derive at the net balance.; June 21, 2009 at 5:59 PM
Crystal Ball said...: Counting the Chickens before the eggs are Hatched!

PG & BOD sure know how to keep a 'FALSE' front.
Already the tithes & offerings recorded a substantial drop ( and they blame it on everything for the drop in collection, expect the TRUE one: the result of members' TOTT)

YET, in the Chart showing where the Funds will come from to meet the impending over RM80M+ for CCC, they already counted in the 2009's takings at RM12 MIllion, and 2010 at RM14 MILLION!

It's all PIE-in-the SKY figures

(they had hoped members were *half asleep and would mistake it to mean MONEY needed is already in the Bag!)

*worn-out by their stretched out 2 days of long opening "Speech", House( PG's) Rules, Chairman's delay tactics, and Extended Ministries Story telling of fantastic self-praised efforts,taking advantage of members' questions to slip-in their 'BuY-in' sales pitch to 'Reinforce' any wavering middle ground members, in case.; June 21, 2009 at 5:59 PM
Do you know? said...: Psalms 112 :128

"God's people must hate FALSEHOOD"

Do you think PG, the Gs, BOD & Assoc Pas in CC
know about this?; June 21, 2009 at 6:07 PM
SICK OF Guneratnam said...: The greed and covetuousness in Prince Guneratnam's heart is also clearly revealed when Steven Kum, one of the Guneratnam's blue-eyed boys, who would even LIE for him, announced that,

' When you think of missions work in India, one would think of going to the poor into the villages.. we have a surprise for you, we are building a church to reach the HIGHER STRATA of SOCIETY!....' (Quote taken from comment by Sound Bites)

God wants the gospel to be preached to the POOR, the OUTCASTs of society, the SCUM of the earth, BUT his royal highness, the man who thinks he is god, Prince Guneratnam, the shameless senior pastor of Calvary Church, Kuala Lumpur, now has plans to preach the gospel to the RICH of India.....sure, lah! The RICH will give good offerings, mah! This is what he is after, MONEY!; June 21, 2009 at 6:23 PM
"UNDERSTOOD" said...: the setting of Constitution Review & Truth Committee Resolutions were thrown out because they were deemed unconstitutional as proposers & seconders of both these Reso have in their God given wisdom stated the Sr. Pastor should not be in the committee.

With PG in the committee, independence will be violated!

Funny, how PG & BOD cannot understand the word 'IN-DE-PEN-DENT"
( but then the BOD was never an Independent Board, so it is too much to expect they ever grasp its true meaning)

BOD are just NINCOMPOOPS!; June 21, 2009 at 6:40 PM
TTG Supporter said...: To Associate Member, you're probably right that they will give that excuse..this means then that the 2 directors of CLM and CCM have been lying to SK to say that they had to raise funds themselves to cover the deficit. Where is all the surplus cash sitting now? In the directors' pockets?; June 21, 2009 at 7:11 PM
Absent becoz of work said...: Dear fellow church members,

I am a voting member but I had to work outstation last fri so missed the AGM. I am reading so much of exciting things happened. Is there any one who recorded the proceedings of the meeting? If you did, can you do many of us a favour and send a copy to CT.

CT, is it too much to ask if there is a possibility of putting the recording for us who could not attend the AGM for very valid reasons, to listen to it.

Thx you all.; June 21, 2009 at 8:11 PM
good pets said...: Noted also that 2 of PG's apple polish boys - RYong and DSeah were also busying themselves during the AGMs trying to round up their ushers to get ready to drag ppl out of the sanctuary in case anyone created a commotion. As I see them standing there, looking so dedicated and ready to do anything for their master - PG, it makes me wonder...do they even realize that PG thinks of them as nothing more than his dogs...RY/DS, go here, go there, fetch this, fetch that.; June 21, 2009 at 9:02 PM
no dumb dumb said...: any chairman that is chosen by PG will definitely be bias as surely PG would choose someone who is on his side and who has listened to his lies and believed it. U think this PG will be so dumb to go choose someone who doesn't agree with him...no way hosea! PG may be evil and cunning, but he is no dumb dumb. obviously he oso does not hv any confidence in his associate pastors to chair the AGM, otherwise he wud hv let the resolution go through. shows how little he thinks of you all, Associate pastors!; June 21, 2009 at 9:24 PM
Lodge A Complaint! said...: Yes, let's do it...

"This opens the door for any unhappy member to file a complaint to AG Council against Pas Ronnie for unscriptural conduct. It also allows any member to get a court order to declare the entire AGM null and void."

Do we need to sign a petition?

LET'S DO THIS!

Let's show the Assemblies of God of Malaysia that those who are in leadership are to be held accountable for their unscriptural conduct - they must not think they can get away with this just because they have man-made titles attached to their names!; June 21, 2009 at 9:56 PM
BEWARE WITCHHUNT 2 said...: Dear Calvarites

If SP or BOD conduct WITCHHUNT 2 or take disciplinary action on any member on blogging, we should organise demostration at church during services to express our displeasure.

Enough is enough when you have SP and BOD who are hard-headed and serve by law instead of by spirit.; June 21, 2009 at 10:23 PM
Query to Edward on CRI and CARED said...: The question raised by Bro. SC during AGM on 20 June 2009 pertaining to the CARED AGENCY and the CRI. I too want to remind Treasurer Edward that you had somehow contradicted your statement, please note too that all meetings with BOD in 2008 had been copied by different ones too and the two EGM dated August 2008 and April 2009 are recorded and captured.

Edaward, many of us can be a witness to your August 2008 presentation on the screen, there is no such things as CRI, why is it so now that you said the CRI was formed in 2008 ?? Please explain yourself again. Beware, do tell the truth, it is different now, the authority will query you again if you are not giving us the correct picture.; June 21, 2009 at 10:32 PM
Getting Closer said...: Financial Catastrophe

So HJK's recommendations to sell the properties valued at RM52,000 MILLION in order to fund PG's CCC, is a step closer to the biggest 'Financial Catastrophe ' in church History in M'sia, as commented here some months ago.

Concerned members of TTG Cause already saw this coming from the day PG rigged the RM150 MILLION budget approval.; June 21, 2009 at 10:36 PM
Hurting Heart said...: Was told by someone today that the outsider Chairman(RChin) not very keen to chair the resolution for the AGM but was somehow 'forced' and 'misused' by SP to chair. Looks like another smart Preacher had been slaughter by our SP. Had he been chosen as another 'scapegoat' just to save the ego of this wealthy and famous SP.; June 21, 2009 at 10:39 PM
Kingdom Stewardship said...: I'm a Calvarite but believe in giving to God where there are greater needs in God's work.

Have a clear conscience that being a believer, you don't need to give to CC if you don't have the conviction from the Holy Spirit.

There are so many worthy needs. CC leaders demostrated poor stewardship. Look at CalvaryLand, Extended Ministries and latest CCC.

I support NECF for they do a great work. This year they need RM200,000in General Fund. You can call them and find out more. Tel 03 7727 8227or visit website www.necf.org.my

Please pray and seek His will for guidance on stewardship. Today, at SIB, the speaker shared her Kitchen Soup ministry of feeding daily 1000 for lunch and 300 for lunch. Many come to know the Lord and got healed.

Many brothers and sisters experienced crushed spirit in CC experienced deliverance and refreshing spirit in the SIB service. Praise the Lord. The Great Shepherd in Ps 23 knows how to lead His sheep to the green pasture (v2), quiet waters (v2) and to be restored in their souls (v3). Be encouraged for the Lord knows your cries.; June 21, 2009 at 10:43 PM
gagged said...: CT must not play into the hands of the unethical tactics of the church regarding the closure of the blogs.
One must look at the relationship of PG and the members who had proposed res 8, 9 and 10.

CT must remain a platform for concerned members voice themselves.

Maybe CT could pass ownership of this blog to a party who is not a voting member nor an associate member if the church goes on a witch-hunt to enforce this freedom curbing motion.

Alternatively, close the blog and let an independent party start it again with the same name.

I am sure there will be parties in the truth, transparency and good governance who will be able to initiate actions which will be able to circumvent whatever is taken by parties who refuse to fear GOD.; June 21, 2009 at 10:49 PM
SIREN ON said...: Has the TRUTH sink in Yet?

Hope the misled followers of PG will wake up to the Facts of CCC:

1. The original Budget of RM150M will be just for the the auditorium, IF/IF/IF it ever get completed...

2.plus All the other BLOCKS, BUT only just "Shell & Core" meaning just the Exterior and inside is all HOLLOW.
In other words the RM150 Budget is already Busted, and more Millions needed !!!

3. PG & BOD told the congregation they will be celebrating Christmas in CCC this Dec 2009. Yet, it was only 15% progress as at Dec 08, and news had it that work is at standstill in recent months.

4. As highlighted by the Auditors in 2009 Ann Report, RM80M+ commitment falls due/ to be met
Now, HJK already propose to SELL properties-- spells Trouble with a capital 'T'

PG's followers, Brace yourselves for more bad news...
but don't worry he has mastered the-art -of making bad things look good, so it will be camouflaged, you don't even know what you got yourselves into.

Be prepared to sell/mortgage your houses or business, and empty your bank account.; June 21, 2009 at 11:02 PM
cronies said...: yes, saw the members of the same family who proposed for the few resolutions all standing in front of the sanctuary after the friday night AGM...tat family has always been known to be cronies of PG.; June 21, 2009 at 11:05 PM
4th WOE said...: Witch-hunt and membership termination are acts of injustice and no mercy shown.

Be warned of the 4th woe in Matt 23:23-24:

Woe to you, teachers of law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You give a tenth of your spices - mint, dill and cummin. But you have neglected the more important matters of the law - justice, mercy and faithfulness. You should have practiced the latter, without neglecting the former. You blind guides! You strain out of a gnat but swallow a camel!

Dr Lum, just believe God in His justice, mercy and faithfully. SP/BOD may terminate more members for ignoring the resolution on blogging. Remain steadfast to stand for truth in Christ even if you have to lose your voting membership. You don't have to tell whether you blog or not or for that matter who is blogging or who is the administrator (it can be just anyone. Important is not who is the administrator but what are the issues of CC); June 21, 2009 at 11:12 PM
A senior member said...: SK said, "I am hurt."at AGM.
SK, please read Now is the Time's good-byes to so-called shepherds of CC and do you feel the hurt behind his/her comment(after Interesting facts from Annual Reports and Accounts)?
I am another old member who is very very badly hurt and concerned by what had happened,what are happening and (shudder) what will happen in CC.
Does any one interesting in saving this CC's 'lost sheep' or only concerns with saving the image and position of the chief shepherd of CC?
This is your choice, dear Pastor SK.; June 21, 2009 at 11:15 PM
CONNECTION AT PLAY said...: to blogger Gagged,
Speaking of "..the relationship of PG and the members who had proposed res 8, 9 and 10", someone ought to check if they are interested parties as sub-contractors or Suppliers to the CCC project (big $$$ at stake)

Also, the new deacon DP, ask him if his firm gets jobs from CC, or PG's personal business, and the BOD's too. Also, if all the "free legal Advice at the sideline, gave him the Deaconship.

After all he had questioned if the scrutineers were in fact independent, so can he do the same for himself,please.; June 21, 2009 at 11:23 PM
Anonymous said...: Hi Calvary Today,, is it possibe to host a online survey (similar to the one on thestar.com.my or the malaysianisider.com. The question should be "Does SP enjoys the confidence of all Calvarites? The responsdents can collect some basic data i.e. voting members,associate members, regualar worshippers or friends of calvary church. It would be a good signal and indication to SP and BOD; June 21, 2009 at 11:38 PM
MIND READER said...: Query to Edward on CRI and CARED said...

Do I Understand that you are referring to CRI i.e. Calvary Relief International?

Indeed, I notice that too. Since when CARED became CRI?

Gosh, first Missions transferred 'lock-stock& barrel the CARE Ministry to CIM, who then simply added "D" to the Acronymn from CARE to CARED.

Now, after this discovery of the "pass-off", they are so Daring to go under another name CRI, for two sly reasons, which are obvious:
1. this word 'INTERNATIONAL" is an all encompassing Magic word, so the original funds reverted from CIM can be used again to play on the International stage for limelight.

2. The tainted CARE & CARED are wiped out from record, so PG & MISSIONS & BOD have no 'blemlish' of this shameful past.

Remember PG in his Sunday 'Speech' had said "NOTHING STICKS" (sub-text: all the expose' by TTG has no effect on him & Gang. Someone said they believe they have 'Teflon' Skin:); June 21, 2009 at 11:53 PM
REAL AGM RESULTS said...: Hi Calvary Worshippers

The result of this AGM is not so much who got elected and which resolutions carried/thrown out/withdrawn.

The result will be more of the degree of harden hearts. Voting members can harden by 30%. Associate members, 60%.

The result will be more of the extent of taking CC as their home church. Voting members going to other churches can increase by 30%. Associate members, 60%

The result will be more of the amount of giving to CC. Voting members will cut giving by 30% but give more elsewhere. Associate members, 60%.

The result will be more of not inviting visitors. Voting members will cut by 40%. Associate members, 80%

I can be wrong. Chances is that I would be wrong. So, your input needed. Particularly more important is for SP/BOD/AP to estimate. Most importantly, the hurting must be comforted whether they remain in CC or they choose to move to other God's church. Certainly, the Lord will have the final say. Jesus, you know better than any of us. Be YOU be all the glory.; June 22, 2009 at 12:46 AM
The Final Curtain said...: What is next for SP?

He survived this AGM unconstitutionally. So, he remains the CEO of CC and fully responsible for the CCC. If CCC is from God, he may survive but no guarantee. If it is not from God, he will go.

The final curtain is very near. I believe mega church building may not necessary be God's method when huge resources are locked in rather than released. In China, official churches with nice building lose out to house churches burning and spreading like wild fire...the anointing of the Holy Spirit, not brick and mortar; June 22, 2009 at 1:03 AM
Call For Demonstration! said...: TTG have shown too much grace and mercy to Prince Guneratnam by not arranging for a demonstration outside the church. This is why he is able to fight back and seems to be winning!!

I just had a look at the pictures of the Iranian demonstrations outside the United Nations building....the banners & posters they had with them tell a story, of how Ahmadinejad had lost his credibility, and now the Iranian people want him OUT!

We should do the same thing for Calvary Church. This will publicize our cause & the Assemblies of God have to be embarrassed enough to take action.

Prince Guneratnam & the APs & the BOD of Calvary Church have been too arrogant and un-bending - they need to be taken down a peg or two!; June 22, 2009 at 9:12 AM
MONEY YOU MUST GIVE; VOICE YOU CAN"T HAVE said...: 1. Money you must give; Voice you can't have:

You are supposed to give to God for God's work but sorry you don't have a say on how, where and what to be used. SP has the final say after 'consulting' the dumb BOD.

2. Your service to God is voluntary; SP and family's is professional

SP said, "we are not your employees" but they are paid more than RM 1 M year as a family. SP said further, "You must come forward to serve. Many areas need your service." but you serve without pay. {We don't mind serving God in God's work not only for free but give money, time and talent. But, SP and his family must not hoard and be coveteous}

You are to submit to spiritual authority; Pastors/BOD are to lord

TTG members wrote in to them, spoke to them, went forward to press them, petitioned to them, presented resolutions to them, spoke and pleaded with them in AGM/EGM but all fell on "deaf ears".

Twice, the resolutions were thrown out because no preliminary notice to invite resolutions for EGM. One, the resolutions were thrown out because they contravene constitution (of course, based on your sole and final interpretation)

SP as Chairman of 1st EGM
Guynes as Chairman of 2nd EGM
Ronnie Chin as Chairman of AGM (on resolutions)

How did they perform together with BOD?

legalistic, not spiritual
lording over members,not setting eg
I'm in control, you submit
I'm right, you are wrong
I'm the leader, you follow
I can preach, you can't
I can use scripture, you can't

Ronnie Chin is worst when he firmly declared, when resolutions were thrown out by BOD, YOU CAN"T DEBATE. YOU CAN ONLY SEEK CLARIFICATIONS ON BOD'S BASIS FOR THROWNING.

The whole CC is under a spirit of strangulation when leaders choose to lord over worshippers. Clear evidence is when SP was about to throw out members who dare to make noise. Immediately, Associate Pastors sprung into action, summoned helpers - they all look like police in a police state (like North Korea).

Sadly, CC is now reduced to a place where people feel so oppressed, so fearful of one another, not trusting one another, deep divide between SP and members - total DISCONNECT.

Is Jesus pleased with sorry state of affairs?

Prayer: "Jesus, have mercy on us. We invite your total intervention." Amen; June 22, 2009 at 9:47 AM
Result 1st part of the meeting on motion and resolution said...: Yes, I agreed with Calvary today. The whole AGM should be declared null and void.

1. The Chairman both PG1 and Ronnie Chin are unconstitutional.

2. The counting process is not scrutinized. The different rounds of votes for different motions and resolutions has got vast difference result either the "YES" and "NO" from those blank simple piece of paper distributed to us. I for once received 2 copies of pink color paper but nevertheless I return it back to the Usher( no point being dishonest to vote 2 times )

3.here are the statistic I copied during the process:

Voting member present as at 8.10pm
530.

Voting members present as at 10.15pm is 631 plus late comers 34, total numbered is 665 (this is when the ballot had been collected and counted for the vote for resolution proposed by BOD on Auditor at 10.15pm)

As at 9.10pm----Voting for Secet ballots ( to vote by raising hands)--Vote for is 294. Vote Against is 239. Total only 533, where are the missing 132??

As at 9.20pm----Vote for moving Resolution to put forward. Vote for is 348, vote against is 217.Total only 565, Where are the missing 100??( this is by raising hands not secret ballot)

Vote for Scruteineers: Vote for is 258, Vote against is 259, total is 517, again where are the missing number of 148?? ( this is by raising hands not secret ballot)

As at 10.15 result for: Vote for Amendment to constitution proposed by BOD, Vote for is 613, vote against is 28, again whee are the missing number of 34?? ( this is by secret ballot)

As at 10.50 pm, Mr Chairman--Ronnie Chin propose a first Motion to move some resolutions to be adjourned to the next day or next week:

Here is the result, again this is by hands( here, I obseved those hands are mainly SP supported)

Vote for are 261, Vote against are 254, total are 515, again where are the missing number of 150??

As at 11.55pm, Again the Mr Chairman moved a Second Motion to carry forward the Resolution to the next day: here is the result:

vote for are 216, vote against are 212, total are 428, what puzzled me is the numbers of voting are dwindling and difference of some votes are 1 to 5!! Again where are the missing 237( can I say, these voters gone home, since it is 12 midnite? or PG saw that his supporters are leaving, hence he proposed to ronnie Chin to move that second motion-- leave it to all you readers's wisdom.

As at 12.05mid-nite. Results for vote to close the blogs vote for 342, vote against 207 ( this is a invalid resolution, no one admitted they are the owner or the administrator of the 4 blogs, in fact, this resolution is "VERY UNCONSTITUTIONAL" yet, the Chairman allowed this resolution to be tabled.

Finally, the meeting adjoured at almost 12.30 mid-night.

My observation is unconstitutional resolution had been put to vote, therefore, the AGM should be declared null and void.

Readers, this comments are for your reading pleasure, please do help and correct if there is any discrepancy as this are my notes during the AGM, thank you in advance.; June 22, 2009 at 10:42 AM
CCC Cost Update in AGM said...: Construction of Calvary Convention Centre needs RM 122 Million more for completion of just the auditorium. This includes minimum AV and furniture. The rest of the Institutional Block, Multipurpose Hall and Language Halls will be SHELF AND CORE. State of the art AV is shelved at the moment.

Construction is delayed 12 months due to changes in design and remedial works for foundation under Contract 1.

Financing of the 122M are:

1. Cash and FD RM20M
2. Loan facility RM35M
3. 2009 Bldg Fund RM12M
4. 2010 church surplus RM14M
5. Balance to be raised RM41 (thru' A) Sale and lease back unencumbered church properties of 53M OR B) Mortgage Loan OR C) Disposal.

Based on 1) and 3), funds on hand is 55M. Actual fund expected to be raised is 3)+4)+5) = 71M.

For 5), if A) is opted we still use existing facilities but pay lease. If B) is opted we use existing facilities but pay principal and interest. If C) is opted, we lose all existing facilities.

Simple calculation for B) - Total loan will be 35M + 41M = 76M. Interest repayment only without paying Principal is 5.32M (based on 7% p.a).

Going forward: Yearly interest is 5.32M, still owe 76M, other structures SHELF and CORE, state-of-art AV not in, yearly maintenance of a few millions. Financial experts can help us with these figures!

Leadership must exercise good stewardship here. Good BOD tells everything before asking worshippers to give. Don't tell half truths to congregation.; June 22, 2009 at 11:32 AM
Crisis of Confidence said...: Why Patrick Wong was booted despite 30 plus years as Deacon? Is he not also in the CCC building committee financial & Admin?

First, he failed to give the yearly statistics of worshippers and faith promise partners.

Second, in 2008 AGM, he said attendance was 3278 but BOD contradicted him as in ceramas 10,200 was used.

Third, voting members lost confidennce in him, the BOD and CCC. Even Veronica active in CCC committee couldn't be voted in.; June 22, 2009 at 11:52 AM
Truth Speaks Out said...: Yes, thank you for the results of the voting....surely, mischief was afoot!

This goes to show how badly corrupted Calvary's shepherds have become - yes, 'rotten to the core' is the right description for the pastors of Calvary Church and the BOD!

How come TTG didn't fore-see this? They should have appointed their own people to double-check the voting, whether by show of hands or by ballotting!

This just goes to show that Prince Guneratnam & his cohorts have such a blatant disregard for justice, righteouness, truth & transparency!

Why should Calvarites continue to bear with this nonsense?

There is no more holiness and the fear of God in the lives of Prince, Petrina, their children, the Associate Pastors, the BOD, and sadly, Ronnie Chin as well - by siding with the evil and corrupt Prince and doing what the Dark Prince had told him to do, makes Ronnie Chin an accomplice to the unrighteousness, the cheating, the lying, the bullying of God's sheep, etc.!; June 22, 2009 at 12:04 PM
Minor correction for comment at 10.42am on result. said...: Some correction please ( my comment on June 22, 10.42am), there is an error on first motion to complete all the resolution on the same day (friday night) or to adjourn some of the resolution to the next day.

1st round or 1st motion proposed by ronnie chin) was actually 261 prefer to complete all the resolutions on the same day whereas 254 prefer to adjourn and have some of the resolutions to the next day.; June 22, 2009 at 12:20 PM
Minor correction on 1st motion said...: Some minor correction on 1st motion. 261 voted for ALL resolutions to be completed on the same night whereas 254 voted against. ( refer earlier comment at 10.42am); June 22, 2009 at 12:27 PM
Feeling Very Oppressed Voting Member said...: BOD approval of the loan of 8 million is unconstitutional. It is not provided for by the Constitution even though the intention was good. BOD has abused their powers.
Can they be disciplined by the Voting Members for abusing the powers given to them?

Can Calvary Today check with their lawyers if there is anything the voting members can do about it?

It is very oppressive to see the Church leadership shutting us down, giving us no right to speak up or voice our dissatisfaction. BOD can take discipline action against members. Voting members should also be able to discipline BOD if they abuse the authority given to them by the voting members.

Calvary Today, plse check with your lawyers about this.; June 22, 2009 at 12:59 PM
Anonymous said...: I dont understand. People power/Authority comes from AGM. No one has the right to denied anything... Not SP/Chairman/BOD nor AOG.

This reminds me of Communism! Stalin, Hitler and Mao Tze Tung erra...

OK. Enough is enough... Let's STOP IT and share the final action for us. I am 101% behind TTG!; June 22, 2009 at 1:24 PM
Anonymous said...: Looking at the behaviour of the APs at the AGM makes me wonder:are these fellas followers of Christ or cult followers of PG?Real shame...men of no conscience!; June 22, 2009 at 2:33 PM
PUBLIC DOMAIN said...: Is there a place for discussion in public domain? My question is why not?

In US, their discussion at the highest level is beamed worldwide. They are not afraid to be heard by even unfriendly countries and parties.

In a church, if we can't be open, how can we call ourselves as light of the world and salt of the earth.

All churches account ought to be OPEN BOOK for all people to see. After all, Jesus see it all. If we are to attract people to come to church, all our policies and practices ought to be both ABOVE BOARD and ABOVE REPROACH.

Whatever we do ought to stand the test of time and public scrutiny.; June 22, 2009 at 2:51 PM
BEWARE of DOGS said...: Please do listen to David Wilkerson

BEWARE OF DOGS

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pK8LVfNmTSc&feature=channel; June 22, 2009 at 3:17 PM
OPPOSITES said...: to PUBLIC DOMAIN said

The 3 'values' are ABSOLUTELY what PG & BOD in CC ought to be!
OPEN BOOK
ABOVE BOARD and
BEYOND REPROACH.

Regrettably, they not only failed miserably on all 3 areas-- on the contrary, the 3 S' apply to them :

SECRETIVE
SCHEMERS
SHAMELESS; June 22, 2009 at 3:22 PM
why am i there said...: I am very dissapointed with the AGM. I am there to vote but is the opposite,,,; June 22, 2009 at 3:39 PM
Anonymous said...: It is the silliest thing
For the doctor to quarrel with his patients
For a private college to quarrel with the students
For company to quarrel with the shareholders
For a shop to quarrel with its customers
BUT
The most stupid of all
Is for the Shepherd to quarrel with his sheep !!

Some pastors are just made that way.; June 22, 2009 at 3:46 PM
Anonymous said...: GREAT GENERALS

Never try to win every battle
They plan rather to win the war
Some battles are waged
So that another, more strategic, be won
Others are merely to test the enemy’s strengths

TTG.....lets get on with the war !

Luk 9:62 Jesus: No man, having put his hand to the plough, and looking back, is fit for the kingdom of God.; June 22, 2009 at 3:46 PM
Now is the Time said... said...: Reposted

Dear CT ,
thank you for all that you have done and I am behind you all the way and my prayers are with you too ! Your efforts in the lord and for Him will not be in vain !

To Prince Guneratnam, Petrina Guneratnam @ Giaw Foon Foon , Pam & Jim Guneratnam , Chris Guneratnam ...oops nearly forgotten it shud be Lee , right ? Peter Ong , Steven Kum , Timothy Ong , Richard Yun , Raymond Yong , David seah , Shereen Wong and all the Board of deacons ,

Once upon a time I have looked up to and very proud of you as my Pastors and leaders , BUT that was indeed in the past . Now I dont want to be associated anymore with Calvary church and what it stands for .....ALL OF YOU have been a great disappointment !!!!!!!!

Instead of bringing healing and reconciliation to the members of the church , you are causing more division and strife within the Body of Christ and now even causing Ps Ronnie Chin and Ps Kelly to be drawn into your web ! O God have mercy !!

Ps RY Fear God rather than man , if your convictions reveal to you to leave , move on as The Lord is your Provider not PG. He will open doors of ministry for you so all you need is to take the step of faith ....

As of now many are deciding to move on ...as they are not being fed their spiritual food, but for those who feel called to remain , let The Lord direct your steps as you are called to remain to be the check and balance in CC before it deteriorates to the place of No Return !

As for myself , this day 21st june 2009, I am finally closing this Calvary Church chapter of my life and move on as whatever that needs to be done and said have been done and Prince Guneratnam and his dynasty can continue to work at helping him fulfill his dream of becoming the prince of Calvary church and this world ...And if they continue to deceive and lead people astray then The LORD WILL hold them accountable for all their deeds .

To my once beloved Calvary Church ......Goodbye :(; June 22, 2009 at 3:48 PM
A Senior Member said... said...: Reposted.

Dear Now is the Time,
It breaks my heart to see another Calvarite leaving CC.
I remember when Dr Christopher Shun wrote to announce his departure, I wrote to him personally (was able to get his email address from his article in Calvary Berita). He left.CC has lost a fine young man who feels the heart-beat of God in his life, ie, mission. God bless Dr. Shun and his family.Am still praying I will see him one day.
You have made your decision. I respect your decision. Though I do not know you but nevertheless I wish to let you know that there is one friend-in-Christ in CC who cares and I pray that whereever you are, our Lord Jesus Christ is with you and your loved ones always.
Praying CC is concerned in keeping its members under its care while also getting new ones to join when everything is put right, when CC is run in the way the Lord meant His church to be.; June 22, 2009 at 3:49 PM
Angry Sheep said...: I echo the sentiments of "Now is the Time"....

"To Prince Guneratnam, Petrina Guneratnam @ Giaw Foon Foon, Pam & Jim Guneratnam , Chris Guneratnam ...oops nearly forgotten it shud be Lee , right ? Peter Ong , Steven Kum , Timothy Ong , Richard Yun , Raymond Yong , David Seah , Shereen Wong and all the Board of deacons ,

Once upon a time I have looked up to and very proud of you as my Pastors and leaders , BUT that was indeed in the past . Now I dont want to be associated anymore with Calvary church and what it stands for .....ALL OF YOU have been a great disappointment !!!!!!!!"
______________

Open Letter to Prince Guneratnam, Petrina Guneratnam @ Giaw Foon Foon, Ronnie Chin, Chris Guneratnam ...oops nearly forgotten it shud be Lee , right ? Peter Ong , Steven Kum , Timothy Ong , Richard Yun , Raymond Yong , David Seah ....

I can not address you as pastors anymore - you have betrayed the high calling of your noble office! Was it the fear of man that brought you to this 'fallen condition' or was it 'the love of money', or both? Just as our once-beloved Guynes was lured by the carrot stick of USD10,000/- to chair last year's EGM, what was YOUR excuse? What caused you to lie, to manipulate, to cheat, to oppress God's sheep?

As pastors, you were supposed to set a good example to the Body of Christ, but now you have brought shame & reproach to the Body, to the Assemblies of God in Malaysia, as well as to the Name of Christ! What TYPE of pastors are you, anyway?

Ezekial 34 talks about bad shepherds who exploit the sheep & care only for themselves. Well, God knows the heart of those who pretend to serve Him but are actually serving themselves and their own interests....

"7 Therefore, ye shepherds, hear the word of the LORD;

8 As I live, saith the Lord GOD, surely because my flock became a prey, and my flock became meat to every beast of the field, because there was no shepherd, neither did my shepherds search for my flock, but the shepherds fed themselves, and fed not my flock;

9 Therefore, O ye shepherds, hear the word of the LORD;

10 Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I am against the shepherds; and I will require my flock at their hand, and cause them to cease from feeding the flock; neither shall the shepherds feed themselves any more; for I will deliver my flock from their mouth, that they may not be meat for them."; June 22, 2009 at 5:15 PM
Weeping Member said...: To members of Ronnie Chin's and Kelly Yap's church

It is with a heavy heart that I am sending this to you, praying that you blog like we do in CC.......

Because your pastors were invited by Tan Sri Guneratnam to help chair our Resolutions, they did not exercise any concern for the members but sided with our BOD quoting our Church Constitution which may not be even ratified through the convening of an EGM .

From the way your pastors behave and speak they themselves may have something to hide to from you.

As church members - pls check all your income, expenditure, Church constitution etc - make sure that your pastors and your Board of Deacons do not have ABSOLUTE power provided by your constitution.

It will be good if you cannot find anything amiss but as you are forewarned that you have to make sure your pastors are not following their "big brother Prince" as he is their mentor....

Briefly DURING AGM
Members have the right to vote, no right to debate and only 2 chances to question. They are denied of proposal to get scrutineers etc...hence all our voting results are questionable.

Associate Members have no right to speak, vote or to debate

OTHER TIMES
Every worshipper (Members, Associate Members and even visitors) are encouraged to give - no respector of your status in church - all money is welcomed.; June 22, 2009 at 7:00 PM
Anonymous said...: as CC continues to grow bigger in number, SP is really acting like those 'ang mo' in other countries like US.. churches in US which are really big does involve in this type of prob..
did SP ever think if he's in a small church? i guess he would be humble..
ergh, how can ppl call him God's follower?; June 22, 2009 at 10:15 PM
Anonymous said...: So so so dissapointed says.....

When I became a christian at CC, I was proud to know of the professionalism and integrity of our BOD and Pastors. I remember very clearly during an altar call, SP said he never lies, it is not just his nature to practice this.....
I even quarrel with my siblings who are non-christian of moneys given as tithes and offerrings to CC are put to good use, no question about it!! Now, I am so ashamed! Sakit Hatilah!!!!!!!!!; June 22, 2009 at 10:54 PM
Anonymous said...: Dear Calvarites, I believe the recent AGM on 19th and 20th June, 2009 is the "tipping point" of change in CC. All Calvarites who desire truth, transparency and good governance has cross the rubicon and it will be very hard for SP and APs to win their hearts and mind back. I only weep for our beloved church who has church pastors, deacons and loyalists who are blind to what is happening. It will begin a tsunami of dis-affection and mistrust in the present leadership. It is not tenable and pray that God will keep and protect our church for His Glory. Remember, 2 Chronicles 7:14..; June 23, 2009 at 12:46 AM
BLINK NOT! said...: to "English Professor's Minuting said..."

Glad you spotted it too--   On Pg 18 of Calvary Church Annual Report under IV.AUDITORS CLARIFICATION ON SPECIAL AUDIT:   BOD Secretary, deliberately Minuted

2."Overseas airfares for grandchild and son of a Deacon"

when infact the correct statement would be:

2. Overseas airfares for SENIOR PASTOR'S grandchild and son of Deacon Patrick Wong.

The same omission of 'SENIOR PASTOR' was deliberately omitted for item,3,4,5 & 9

REASON?
Well, it's blatantly obvious PG wouldn't allow his name to be seen in such BAD & UGLY light! and the Sec. Benedette Foo collaborated to hide this truth.
(this is the kind of deceit in PG & BOD!)

By the way, PG was so quick ( at the blink of an eye!) to move to pass this said Minutes,( while distraction was going on over the results of the Deacons' nomination) that those who had prepared to ask for amendments for 2,3,4,5 &9 missed it.

Well, that's how sly PG is!; June 23, 2009 at 12:51 AM
NO ESCAPE said...: As the saying goes " There is no perfect crime "

So, a member took the pain to comb through the Mission Financial Report,( under Missions Fund on Pg 2, item Missions & Evangelism ) and discovered to his horror:
1. that CC only gave *RM 5,017 per month to
Missions & Evangelism in 2007.
( out of the RM260,208, RM200,000 was for
CIM!, which in means in Truth, the balance of
only *RM 60,208 was use for Genuine (one hopes it
is so) missions purpose.

2. that CC had bad accounting policies & practices by not disclosing the costs of the buildings bought with Missions Funds
Both 1&2 were confirmed FACTUAL by Edward Rajasingam, the Deacon/Treasurer at the AGM.

Now, this revelation then confirms what "LION SHARE" said in an earlier comment in CT that
"... In effect, if one study the expenditure carefully, only left-over CRUMBS are used for "Kingdom's work.

CRUMBS, INDEED.

Let's pray those who are still under the Spell of PG, will wake up.; June 23, 2009 at 1:21 AM
Missing Words in EGM Minutes said...: Upon reading blogger "Blink Not" comment at 12.51am on 23rd Jun 09, I had to page up countless times to see what blogger "English Professor's Minuting" had actually said.

For the benefit of all readers, I am now reproducing "English Professor's Minuting" comment in its entirety so that you don't have to page up countless times. There was also item 6 which was not highlighted by blogger "Blink Not".

English Professor's Minuting said...

BOD Secretary can omit (WORDS IN CAPITAL) where necessary:

In pg 18 of Calvary Church Annual Report under IV.AUDITORS CLARIFICATION ON SPECIAL AUDIT:

2. Overseas airfares for SENIOR PASTOR'S grandchild and son of a Deacon (PW)

3. Scholarship FOR SENIOR PASTOR'S CHILDREN to study in the United States

4. Medical expenses RM40,000 for SENIOR PASTOR'S grandchild soon after birth

5. RM15,000 for SENIOR PASTOR's membership fees at the Jackie Chan's California Fitness gym

6. No declaration of monies received BY SENIOR PASTOR from local and overseas ministries

9. Appraisals, salary and increments of SENIOR PASTOR'S children and spouses not known to Board of Deacons

PS. Some believe Secretary who is an English Professor wrote them but PG (always has the FINAL SAY in everything in Calvary Church) chose to delete so that he and his family look squeeky clean.

June 21, 2009 7:08 AM; June 23, 2009 at 10:02 AM
MORE OMISSIONS said...: Thanks to" Missing Words in EGM Minutes said.."
for the Complete& Correct version of what should have been Minuted for item 2,3,4,5,6 &9.

Actually, there is another critical OMISSION of a very important statement the Auditor Tam Kok Meng had made in this finding--the gist of it:
"some benefits, and the *scholarship was however, NOT known to the Staff when they were asked "

PG & BOD had claimed and misled members that this* benefit was open to all staff!. Another BIG lie of theirs.; June 23, 2009 at 1:55 PM
Anonymous said...: SICK OF Guneratnam said...

The greed and covetuousness in Prince Guneratnam's heart is also clearly revealed when Steven Kum, one of the Guneratnam's blue-eyed boys, who would even LIE for him, announced that,

' When you think of missions work in India, one would think of going to the poor into the villages.. we have a surprise for you, we are building a church to reach the HIGHER STRATA of SOCIETY!....' (Quote taken from comment by Sound Bites)
==============================

I'm not a Calvarite.
However, I gave this church the benefit of doubt and attended - and I left with the same sentiments as above .... never to return.
The impression that the whole church was living through a perpetual "gag-order" from those with vested interests, was quite apparent.
I'm glad that Calvarites are now beginning to open their eyes to the events that was so obvious to me 5 yrs ago.
God Bless you.; June 23, 2009 at 3:34 PM
Anonymous said...: Anyone know what is SP's salary..eh? Curious.

If he has a high pay and yet all the expenses are paid for, so nice for him. He should have called for a vote and not hide behind the Church Constitution.

And Brother Philip are real lier. The AGM has taken so many many hours and yet he CAN say no strife, no division.

He think we are all stupid?; June 23, 2009 at 3:56 PM
Crossing The Rubicon said...: Dear Calvarites...

After the AGM, calvarites who desires truth, transparency and good governance have cross the rubicon... it is a point of no return and let's trust God to do His Mighty work,.. let's be reminded in 2 Chronicles 7:14.. and not be arrogant and wait for the mighty power of God and Grace to work in our lives and CC.Let's refrain from ungodly and carnal remarks and be sensitive to God's voice to seek Him and pray for deliverance and the return to the pentecostal anointing we used to experience in the early days of AOG in Malaysia.; June 24, 2009 at 2:20 AM
Cash Flow Out said...: Anon At 3.56 pm...

hey, brother/sister, where have you been this past one year? We have mentioned his salary several times over on this blog...it's a salary that even the PM of Malaysia does not have! Look at the financial reports under salary you wil find that everymonth the Church dishes out more then a RM100,000/- to pastors & staff - wow, Calvary Church is like a big conglomerate with hundreds of staff! The salaries of the Guneratnam immediate family is also not known by the BOD - everything is lumped under SALARIES. And I won't even mention the perks, the EPF payments, etc!; June 24, 2009 at 9:26 AM
A FINE COMB said...: CORRECTION
reference to 'Cash Flow out' said

The actual stipends in the 2009 Annual Report stated the Stipends at RM2,394,708.
So, that will be almost RM200,000 a month( and not Rm 100K) as you erroneously stated.

If EPF/Socso Staff expenses included, then it's RM2,752,078 (or est. Rm230K a month)

However, if all the Extended Ministries are added ( which will be the TRUE reflection of actual Stipends, or Salaries /Allowances, etc it is rocketed to RM3,605,052!!!(Ringgit Three Million, six hundred and five thousand and fifty two ) Like many other expense/income items, they are spread out, park under various classifications they make -up, or they fancy, that the TRUE picture is buried.

Please nOTE, most of these Heads or DIRECTORS of these Extended Ministries are the SAME personnel who hold position as Sr. Assoc. pastors, Assoc Pastors, etc.
Therefore, they are drawing $$$ from 'every where' under ALLOWANCES, SALARIES& RELATED Expenses, HONORARIUM.( the many terms they use for Money given out under expenditure)

Honestly, None us, Except for the *individual themselves and all their collaborators know exactly how much they get all these 41 years. All we can fall back is 'keep Guessing' ! ( even NOT all the BOD know PG's& Wife actual Stipends & total Perks Package, that's how SECRETIVE they control the Financial Stewardship of the CC.

As it was pointed out it's LION SHARE for themselves, first, and then left-over CRUMBs for Kingdom's work.; June 24, 2009 at 7:10 PM
Cash Flow Out said...: Thank you, A Fine Comb, for the correction.

Looks like it is worse than I thought! This is daylight robbery, in the HOUSE OF GOD, committed by the Guneratnam family!

How blinded are those who still support them! it's a case of 'the blind follow the blind, & both shall fall into the ditch'!; June 24, 2009 at 10:38 PM
m with u said...: To all Calvery members,
all u guys have to do is STOP giving monies. This will floor the Chief. This is effective. All projects will come to a STOP. Until Chief resigns, then restart the Projects.; June 28, 2009 at 11:37 PM

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Saturday, June 20, 2009

AGM of Shame

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