Dr Lum Siew Heng , a deacon highly respected by the TTG group, has taken that heroic step and submitted his resignation from the Board of Deacons just a few hours ago. We could almost hear the angels in heaven clapping and cheering.
Just when we thought that our prayers may not be answered, God has, once again, proven His faithfulness to us and shown us that He is still in control. We thank God for giving our dear deacon the courage and boldness to say, “Enough is enough”.
When Neil Armstrong stepped on the moon, he said those famous words “That’s one small step for man, one giant leap for mankind”.
When Dr Lum took that one small step and put in his resignation, it was a giant leap for Truth, Transparency and Governance. This one small step speaks volume and gives great encouragement to us and hopefully, all of you who have been one with us in our struggle to re-establish truth, transparency, proper governance, good stewardship, accountability and integrity in our beloved church.
Let us continue to pray that the rest of the deacons will emulate Dr Lum and do what is right.
Dr Lum, CalvaryToday salutes you!
Saturday, November 22, 2008
Saturday, November 15, 2008
CIM to be De-Registered by NECF (revised with additional comments 17-11-08)
Calvary International Ministries (CIM), the personal ministry of our Senior Pastor (SP), Rev Prince Guneratnam is to be de-registered by the National Evangelical Christian Fellowship (NECF) Malaysia as it does NOT meet the membership conditions of NECF’s constitution.
CIM was established on 8 September 2002 as a personal ministry of SP. It was and has never been a part of Calvary Church. It is definitely not an extended ministry of Calvary Church and does not come under the covering of our church. Hitherto, it has derived its legitimacy by being registered as a member of NECF.
At the church AGM in March this year, when Sis Liza posed several questions on CIM, SP has vehemently defended his personal ministry and declared that no-one has the right to question this ministry. At the recent EGM, a lawyer was brought in to establish the fact that CIM is a personal ministry and therefore, the RM1.9m that was transferred from the church missions fund to CIM over the last several years, cannot be claimed back by the church despite the fact that members’ approval has not been sought.
After the AGM, the TTG members investigated and discovered that the constitution of NECF does not allow the registration of personal ministries as a member. On 20 May 2008, Bro KC wrote to NECF for answers to several questions among which are to check if NECF is providing spiritual covering for CIM and if CIM is registered with them as personal ministry. Bro KC did not receive any reply from NECF but Bro Hong Meng, following up on Bro KC’s letter, was verbally informed by an official there that they had, all this while, thought that CIM was a part of Calvary Church and on that assumption, NECF had accepted CIM as a member. We wonder what was the basis for that assumption. If it is because of a document or representation given by CIM or Calvary Church at the time of application, then it can be inferred that a misrepresentation had taken place. If no such misrepresentation had been made, then NECF may have been careless in approving CIM's membership in 2003. We doubt that NECF was careless and we believe that they were somehow "misled" or "misinformed". It may be interesting to note that SP was the Chairman of NECF when CIM became a member. As the Chairman, SP should know the NECF membership criteria and the ineligibility of CIM to be a member of NECF.
Check out the July-Aug 2003 NECF newsletter at this website: http://www.necf.org.my/index.cfm?&menuid=21. This fact of SP's Chairmanship in NECF and the announcement of CIM's membership are published in the newsletter. There is also an interesting article in the newsletter by SP on the moral integrity of the church leaders.
On 21 August 2008, Bro Hong Meng wrote to NECF to find out their plans now that it is an established fact that CIM is not part of Calvary Church. On 9 October 2008, NECF replied that “CIM does not meet the membership conditions of our (NECF) constitution and our (NECF) membership roll will be rectified accordingly”. We believe the de-registration of CIM as a member of NECF is in the due process or already done. Here, we must salute NECF for their “bravery” to take such affirmative steps to put things right.
The question that springs to mind now is what will likely happen to CIM? We are fearful that the balance money of almost RM1 million in CIM might be swiftly spent or taken out by SP. We are not so concerned with the RM400,000 left in CARED as the Board of Deacons, at the EGM, has stated that CARED and presumably, the money remaining therein, will become an extended ministry of the church. There were no plans to transfer CIM to church as an extended ministry. We understood then that SP had objected to this. In fact, when another member (the simple housewife) appealed to SP at the EGM to give all the balance RM1 million to the CCC building fund, SP had stood his ground and would not release the money.
Now, with this change in circumstances and if the money is still in CIM, it is quite likely that SP will have no choice but to move CIM to church as an extended ministry. This is the only way, CIM can be legitimate. It is the only way for CIM to maintain a bank account to hold its funds. It is the only way for CIM to continue as SP’s channel to raise money to fund his extensive traveling to attend seminars and conferences around the world. (In church circles, for preaching invitations, usually, the host church pays for the travel costs and usually, with love offering thrown in as well). It is the only way, CIM can be deemed as a religious organization to avoid becoming taxable as otherwise, all offerings and gifts received by CIM will become taxable.
DO NOT BE SURPRISED if this option of becoming an extended ministry of the church is taken by SP because we see it as the ONLY OPTION available to him. In plain language, he has NO CHOICE.
Of course, even after it is moved to church as an extended ministry, several questions still remain to be answered, which are:
1. The balance RM1 million in CIM may be liable to tax as it was accumulated during the period when it was “misrepresented” as a Christian organization under NECF. In fact, the entire RM1.9 million which was transferred from church to CIM may be taxable. It will be interesting if the taxman get wind of this.
2. What were the documents given to the banks for the opening of the bank accounts of CIM and CARED? If they were NECF membership documents and now that CIM is de-registered, will the balance money in the banks be frozen? If the banks return the money, who will the bank return the money to?
3. If misrepresentation has been made to NECF which resulted in CIM being accepted as a member, can criminal proceedings be instituted against the perpetrator? This is because, besides Calvary Church, some individuals and other churches may have given gifts to CIM in the belief that it is a legitimate Christian organisation under the umbrella of NECF.
Whatever unfolds over the next few days or weeks, we hope our dear SP and the Board of Deacons are well prepared to deal with the issues which may arise. Things seem to be heating up. Just to let you know, 2 Calvarites have boldly stepped forward and have informed us, in no uncertain terms, that they are prepared and ready to go to the authorities. All they are waiting for is our signal. Unbeknown to them, that has put a very heavy burden on the TTG “committee”. We are prayerfully, waiting on the Lord. Let’s all pray that it does not come to that.
God Bless.
CIM was established on 8 September 2002 as a personal ministry of SP. It was and has never been a part of Calvary Church. It is definitely not an extended ministry of Calvary Church and does not come under the covering of our church. Hitherto, it has derived its legitimacy by being registered as a member of NECF.
At the church AGM in March this year, when Sis Liza posed several questions on CIM, SP has vehemently defended his personal ministry and declared that no-one has the right to question this ministry. At the recent EGM, a lawyer was brought in to establish the fact that CIM is a personal ministry and therefore, the RM1.9m that was transferred from the church missions fund to CIM over the last several years, cannot be claimed back by the church despite the fact that members’ approval has not been sought.
After the AGM, the TTG members investigated and discovered that the constitution of NECF does not allow the registration of personal ministries as a member. On 20 May 2008, Bro KC wrote to NECF for answers to several questions among which are to check if NECF is providing spiritual covering for CIM and if CIM is registered with them as personal ministry. Bro KC did not receive any reply from NECF but Bro Hong Meng, following up on Bro KC’s letter, was verbally informed by an official there that they had, all this while, thought that CIM was a part of Calvary Church and on that assumption, NECF had accepted CIM as a member. We wonder what was the basis for that assumption. If it is because of a document or representation given by CIM or Calvary Church at the time of application, then it can be inferred that a misrepresentation had taken place. If no such misrepresentation had been made, then NECF may have been careless in approving CIM's membership in 2003. We doubt that NECF was careless and we believe that they were somehow "misled" or "misinformed". It may be interesting to note that SP was the Chairman of NECF when CIM became a member. As the Chairman, SP should know the NECF membership criteria and the ineligibility of CIM to be a member of NECF.
Check out the July-Aug 2003 NECF newsletter at this website: http://www.necf.org.my/index.cfm?&menuid=21. This fact of SP's Chairmanship in NECF and the announcement of CIM's membership are published in the newsletter. There is also an interesting article in the newsletter by SP on the moral integrity of the church leaders.
On 21 August 2008, Bro Hong Meng wrote to NECF to find out their plans now that it is an established fact that CIM is not part of Calvary Church. On 9 October 2008, NECF replied that “CIM does not meet the membership conditions of our (NECF) constitution and our (NECF) membership roll will be rectified accordingly”. We believe the de-registration of CIM as a member of NECF is in the due process or already done. Here, we must salute NECF for their “bravery” to take such affirmative steps to put things right.
The question that springs to mind now is what will likely happen to CIM? We are fearful that the balance money of almost RM1 million in CIM might be swiftly spent or taken out by SP. We are not so concerned with the RM400,000 left in CARED as the Board of Deacons, at the EGM, has stated that CARED and presumably, the money remaining therein, will become an extended ministry of the church. There were no plans to transfer CIM to church as an extended ministry. We understood then that SP had objected to this. In fact, when another member (the simple housewife) appealed to SP at the EGM to give all the balance RM1 million to the CCC building fund, SP had stood his ground and would not release the money.
Now, with this change in circumstances and if the money is still in CIM, it is quite likely that SP will have no choice but to move CIM to church as an extended ministry. This is the only way, CIM can be legitimate. It is the only way for CIM to maintain a bank account to hold its funds. It is the only way for CIM to continue as SP’s channel to raise money to fund his extensive traveling to attend seminars and conferences around the world. (In church circles, for preaching invitations, usually, the host church pays for the travel costs and usually, with love offering thrown in as well). It is the only way, CIM can be deemed as a religious organization to avoid becoming taxable as otherwise, all offerings and gifts received by CIM will become taxable.
DO NOT BE SURPRISED if this option of becoming an extended ministry of the church is taken by SP because we see it as the ONLY OPTION available to him. In plain language, he has NO CHOICE.
Of course, even after it is moved to church as an extended ministry, several questions still remain to be answered, which are:
1. The balance RM1 million in CIM may be liable to tax as it was accumulated during the period when it was “misrepresented” as a Christian organization under NECF. In fact, the entire RM1.9 million which was transferred from church to CIM may be taxable. It will be interesting if the taxman get wind of this.
2. What were the documents given to the banks for the opening of the bank accounts of CIM and CARED? If they were NECF membership documents and now that CIM is de-registered, will the balance money in the banks be frozen? If the banks return the money, who will the bank return the money to?
3. If misrepresentation has been made to NECF which resulted in CIM being accepted as a member, can criminal proceedings be instituted against the perpetrator? This is because, besides Calvary Church, some individuals and other churches may have given gifts to CIM in the belief that it is a legitimate Christian organisation under the umbrella of NECF.
Whatever unfolds over the next few days or weeks, we hope our dear SP and the Board of Deacons are well prepared to deal with the issues which may arise. Things seem to be heating up. Just to let you know, 2 Calvarites have boldly stepped forward and have informed us, in no uncertain terms, that they are prepared and ready to go to the authorities. All they are waiting for is our signal. Unbeknown to them, that has put a very heavy burden on the TTG “committee”. We are prayerfully, waiting on the Lord. Let’s all pray that it does not come to that.
God Bless.
Sunday, November 9, 2008
Post EGM - Another Deception at EGM?
At the recent EGM, a question was posed to the Board of Deacons on the retirement age of Senior Pastor (SP) and Bro Patrick Wong elaborated that under our church constitution, there is no retirement age specified for SP. This deacon tried to hoodwink the congregation by side-stepping the ‘real question’. Everyone who has read our church constitution knows that the constitution does not have any reference to the retirement age for SP. The question was not whether the constitution provided for SP’s retirement but what was the retirement age for SP. In other words, what is our church policy with regards to the retirement age for SP.
In his answer, Bro Patrick did not mention that our church has a Staff Handbook which addresses this issue. Under Section 2 of the handbook, ALL the staff of the church are classified into 3 categories namely,
1) Pastoral and Ministerial Staff
2) Office Staff
3) General/Technical Staff
Under the description of “Pastoral and Ministerial Staff”, it is stated that “Senior Pastor heads the pastoral team (pastoral and ministerial team) comprising staff categories such as Senior Associate Pastors, Associate Pastors, Assistant Pastors and Ministerial Staff.”
It is obvious that SP as the head of the Pastoral and Ministerial Staff, falls into this first staff category. He is certainly not part of the Office Staff or General/Technical Staff.
Section 11 (1) states that the Retirement Age of all Church Staff, with the exception of Pastors, will be 55 years of age. Section 11 (2) states that the Retirement Age for Pastors will be 60 years of age.
(Click to enlarge image. To return to this page, Click "BACK" at top left hand corner)
Both SP (who is 63 this year) and Sis Petrina (who is 64 this year) have crossed the retirement age specified in the handbook.
The questions which needs to be answered are:
1. Were there contracts signed for the extension of employment of both SP and his wife?
2. Were the contracts approved by the Board of Deacons?
3. Was SP’s extension contract brought before the church members at an AGM or EGM to be approved as required under the constitution? (None of the TTG members and other members remembers such an event) His extension as Senior Pastor, may be NULL AND VOID, if not approved by members at an AGM or EGM.
4. What are the terms of their contracts?
Not too long ago, a long-serving church staff retired at age 57 (after her retirement was initially overlooked by the church administrator) and SP offered her re-employment at less than half her last drawn salary. She left in total disgust, hurt and disillusioned. We hope that SP has applied this same condition to himself and his wife and are now drawing not more than half the amount of their last drawn salaries. If not, then they are nothing but pure hypocrites. Pastors as our leaders should always follow God’s principle of using the same measure in everything they do. They must practice what they preach.
Now, back to our dear Bro Patrick. It is now clear that Bro Patrick, by answering the way he did, was trying to deceive the 800 members present at the EGM. He has been on the Board of Deacons since 1975 and therefore, he cannot claim ignorance of the Staff Handbook, which was probably approved by the deacons. And SP, by keeping mum, during Bro Patrick’s answer is guilty of abetting the deception.
We reiterate our call on Bro Patrick to resign. He was not man enough to resign when we first called on him to do so in our 8th Update. We hope he has enough integrity left in him to do so now.
As for SP, who has lost most of the members’ respect, we beseech him to leave gracefully so that Calvary Church can be restored to its former glory. There has been enough pain, hurt and lives destroyed in this whole saga.
We recognise that he has done a lot for Calvary Church in his early 30-odd years. We acknowledge his contribution and we thank God for him but it is time for him to let go. It’s time for him to move on to the next phase in life. All we ask is that he returns Calvary Church back to God!
In his answer, Bro Patrick did not mention that our church has a Staff Handbook which addresses this issue. Under Section 2 of the handbook, ALL the staff of the church are classified into 3 categories namely,
1) Pastoral and Ministerial Staff
2) Office Staff
3) General/Technical Staff
Under the description of “Pastoral and Ministerial Staff”, it is stated that “Senior Pastor heads the pastoral team (pastoral and ministerial team) comprising staff categories such as Senior Associate Pastors, Associate Pastors, Assistant Pastors and Ministerial Staff.”
It is obvious that SP as the head of the Pastoral and Ministerial Staff, falls into this first staff category. He is certainly not part of the Office Staff or General/Technical Staff.
Section 11 (1) states that the Retirement Age of all Church Staff, with the exception of Pastors, will be 55 years of age. Section 11 (2) states that the Retirement Age for Pastors will be 60 years of age.
(Click to enlarge image. To return to this page, Click "BACK" at top left hand corner)
Both SP (who is 63 this year) and Sis Petrina (who is 64 this year) have crossed the retirement age specified in the handbook.
The questions which needs to be answered are:
1. Were there contracts signed for the extension of employment of both SP and his wife?
2. Were the contracts approved by the Board of Deacons?
3. Was SP’s extension contract brought before the church members at an AGM or EGM to be approved as required under the constitution? (None of the TTG members and other members remembers such an event) His extension as Senior Pastor, may be NULL AND VOID, if not approved by members at an AGM or EGM.
4. What are the terms of their contracts?
Not too long ago, a long-serving church staff retired at age 57 (after her retirement was initially overlooked by the church administrator) and SP offered her re-employment at less than half her last drawn salary. She left in total disgust, hurt and disillusioned. We hope that SP has applied this same condition to himself and his wife and are now drawing not more than half the amount of their last drawn salaries. If not, then they are nothing but pure hypocrites. Pastors as our leaders should always follow God’s principle of using the same measure in everything they do. They must practice what they preach.
Now, back to our dear Bro Patrick. It is now clear that Bro Patrick, by answering the way he did, was trying to deceive the 800 members present at the EGM. He has been on the Board of Deacons since 1975 and therefore, he cannot claim ignorance of the Staff Handbook, which was probably approved by the deacons. And SP, by keeping mum, during Bro Patrick’s answer is guilty of abetting the deception.
We reiterate our call on Bro Patrick to resign. He was not man enough to resign when we first called on him to do so in our 8th Update. We hope he has enough integrity left in him to do so now.
As for SP, who has lost most of the members’ respect, we beseech him to leave gracefully so that Calvary Church can be restored to its former glory. There has been enough pain, hurt and lives destroyed in this whole saga.
We recognise that he has done a lot for Calvary Church in his early 30-odd years. We acknowledge his contribution and we thank God for him but it is time for him to let go. It’s time for him to move on to the next phase in life. All we ask is that he returns Calvary Church back to God!
Thursday, November 6, 2008
The Importance of This Blog
BREAKING NEWS!!!
Once again, we wish to express our heartfelt thanks to Bro. Vijay, for his invaluable advice to us, which we appreciate very much. Here is his advice to us to COPYRIGHT the contents in this blog, which was posted as a Comment on November 9, 2008. We have since taken heed to his advice and has therefore included the COPYRIGHT clause in this blog. God is Good.
CT
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Bamboo Conspiracy said...
COPYRIGHT THE KNOWLEDGE CONTENT OF THIS BLOG
It is amazing, as a Christian researcher, I have been searching the Internet for sound case study material on Church Governance but never really found such detailed analysis as I found in this Blog. Here you can find a wealth of case study material on Church Governance on the following topics:
1. Church Organisation Structure
2. Church Constitution
3. Church Administration and Accounting
4. Church Staff Handbook
5. Conduct of Pastoral Staff
6. Truth, Transparency & Accountability
I strongly recommend that the Webmaster copyright all the knowledge content in this Blog to prevent plagiarism. This way anybody using material from this Blog must obtain written permission from the Webmaster before it can be published elsewhere. Furthermore, it will save guard the interest of Calvary Church and prevent people twisting the facts contained here for their own purposes.
I reiterate, this Blog has the potential to become the defector research resource for real life case study on Church Governance and the basis for the publication of 101 on Church Governance. All you mature and discerning bloggers could contribute towards this task as part of the Post Calvary Church gift to God’s Kingdom. I strong belief nobody can publish Best Practices Guideline on Church Governance without consulting this Blog.
In fact, any Church Governance publication that does not refer to this Blog has not done sufficient research and such a book would probably be worthless. Please protect the knowledge content of this Blog immediately.
Dr. Paramsothy Vijayan
www.normangrubb.com
November 9, 2008 7:32 PM
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CT & TTG give all PRAISE AND GLORY to our LORD JESUS CHRIST for giving us wisdom and guidance each step of the way since the beginning of this whole saga. We will continue to avail ourselves to our MASTER AND HEAVENLY FATHER, to be obedient and to allow ourselves to be of His service, to see to the fulfillment of HIS WILL AND PURPOSES here on earth. We also like to thank these brothers who have put in their Positive Comments with regards to this Blog.
To the rest of you, whom we have not quoted, we also thank you for your encouraging comments to help us along in this arduous journey. We reiterate our call here to everyone to BLOG RESPONSIBLY with the KINGDOM OF GOD in mind. Let us not be rumour-mongers but be truth-bearers. And do not forget to PRAY because prayer is the key to victory, prayer is the key that unlocks the door for God's intervention into our lives and into our church. PRAYER CHANGES THINGS.
Thank you and God Bless All.
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Bamboo Conspiracy said...
Dear Bro & Sis in Christ.
I am a member of a Christian research commission. I am in deep sorrow in reading of events that has been discussed in the blog regarding an historical church, Calvary Church Malaysia. I too suffer with the church because when a member suffers, the Whole body of Christ suffers with it. I surely don't want to see events that has been mentioned in the blog to happen to any other churches. Furthermore, I also pray that the sole purpose of the blog as mentioned in the purpose and objective statement is strictly maintained. Otherwise, the blog that started positively with clear objectives will lose its perspective and end up in ruin because of comments outside the objective. Those who comment must make sure what they write is within the objective and in the spirit of love, truth and accountability.
THE IMPORTANCE OF THIS BLOG.
As a Christian researcher let me be one of the first to say that, this blog is important - not only to members of Calvary Church but also to others in the Malaysian Christian community. I am all for disclosure in blogs. The blog is after all a neutral tool used for communication. Perhaps the Teh Tarek Group (TTG) never expected this blog to become so important when they first started it and was bold enough to speak the truth in love. As long as what is disclosed is done with the sincere desire to disseminate TRUTH IN LOVE – it will serve its purposes and receive the blessings of the Lord. Furthermore, it also provides a platform for those who are disheartened to express their hurts and feelings - rightly or wrongly.
This blog has done what I have been fighting to do for the past two years - the need for guidelines on Church Governance. There is a lack of transparency in Churches worldwide and in Malaysia. What I had failed to achieve in two years, this blog did within two months! - for the right or wrong reasons! In the past, I have at different occasions called for the need for Church Governance but every time, I was told, "it is a sensitive issue and it is best left for the individual churches to sort out its own internal problems". I kept hitting a stonewall - then came along this blog! It has now become the defector education forum (rightly or wrongly) on church governance and has enabled others to witness firsthand what can happen in a church when there is a lack of transparency, accountability and church governance (perceived or true).
As I said earlier, the blog serves its purpose. This I know because various Christians have approached me from other denomination regarding the issues at Calvary after reading the blog. The happenings in Calvary have become a revelation (rightly or wrongly) and have enabled the members, the BODs and the leaders in other churches to re-examine themselves in the light of events discussed in the blogs and correct any internal flaws that may exist in their present church structure and governance.
Take for example, the CIM Travelling Expenses disclosed in this blog. A cell leader from another church informed that he became very concerned in seeing the CIM Travelling Expenses and reading the blogs and comments. He said, at the next church leaders’ meeting, he is going to advice the church leaders to disclose in detail the church expenses and how it was used to expand God's kingdom. He wanted to make sure that church funds are used not only in travels and attending conferences but also in soul winning.
Similarly, another church member (the treasurer) had informed that he has decided to disclose additional information in the monthly church accounts for greater transparency. These are just two examples I know of how this blog has enlightened (rightly or wrongly) other Christians on the importance of Church Governance, transparency and accountability.
NOTE: I want to congratulate the brother for disclosing his name – that is transparency and accountability. He is willing to take responsibility for disclosing that information in the CIM Travelling Expenses and should be commended. He is willing to be answerable to the truthfulness of the content. This is want I want to see in the blog more and more – accountability.
My one and only concern is the long-term integrity of this blog. The integrity of this blog must be preserved at all cost for the sake of its educational value and the future unity of Calvary Church. Hence, the call for transparency and accountability in all those who blog. Remember, the present problem at Calvary Church WILL be resolved one day - only God knows the timing - but it will happen. THEN STARTS THE HARD WORK of bringing reconciliation, closure and inner healing for all – for there will be those who are hurt in each camp - the ones in support of the TTG and those who may not fully agree with all that the TTG represent (for the right or wrong reasons). Only the Lord knows the outcome.
Our spiritual fathers teach us that God is always of the side of Truth. During the Second World War, Christians in both camps, the Allies and the Axis, prayed but, God is always on the side of Truth and in the providence of God, Hitler was defeated. Then, commence reconciliation and closure.
From what I have heard, there is evidence, the Blog has positively (for the right or wrong reasons) contributed to Christians within and without Calvary Church. Nevertheless, we need to think of the wounded members when in the near future the current issues in Calvary Church are resolved and reconciliation commences.
For this reason alone, this Blog must preserve its integrity and transparency and hence the need for wisdom and spiritual maturity to make sure every comment we make does not return to hound us in the future. An unkind word, a hurtful remark, name calling – once written cannot be retracted. As long as the blog continues to expose SIN in the church and bloggers are willing to be accountable, the blog is on track. Let TRUTH prevail but in LOVE! We cannot run away from TRUTH or FACTS.
I believe that those who display information in the blog are mature and responsible enough to ensure what they report is based on TRUTH and FACT. It is rewarding to see some of the bloggers are willing to disclose their names when financial figures and charts are displayed. That is accountability and transparency.
Vijay
http://www.normangrubb.com/
vijay.newdawn@gmail.com
THESE ARE MY PERSONAL VIEWS AND NOT NECESSARILY THE VIEWS OF THE NECF.
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hm said...
I agree with bamboo conspiracy. We must always maintain our dignity and Christian attributes especially when we are hurt, angry or disappointed. We must not lash out in anger. Others may do so but we must not. Otherwise we would be reduced to their level of unchristian behavior. All my postings are in my name. I have not commented except when asked to respond, again always in my name.
Unfortunately just as I do not seem to be able to influence the BOD or the pastors, I also do not have much influence over the TT members. And I believe most of the extreme comments are not from the TTG because we always remind each other to maintain proper decorum when blogging on this site. The webmaster seems to have removed comments which are deemed unacceptable and I have to trust his/her judgment.
Hong Meng
November 2, 2008 6:36 PM
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Winslow said...
Well said, brother Jay.
You are absolutely right in reminding us that the going-ons at CC have become a revelation and have enabled our fellow brothers in other churches to re-examine themselves in the light of events discussed in CT, and hopefully in the process correct any internal flaws that may exist in their church structure and governance.
At times we Christians are afraid to either reveal the truth or see the truth revealed for fear that it will hurt others, and that it will split the local church. Sure, truth does hurt at times, and we are witnessing this in CC, but if we love God and His Church we need to be courageous to go through it, and if need be, bite the bullet, so to say. Even if we come out of this saga wounded, spiritually and emotionally, and hopefully not physically, it's certainly worth it if God's Kingdom is firmly established in our land. God's Mighty Holy Spirit certainly knows how to heal and restore His church.
Initially I was also hesitant to subscribe to the cause of TTG. By the way, there's no membership roll, and all are welcome as there are definitely no PRIVILEGES at all. But one caution though - be prepared for non-stop criticisms by those on the other side of the divide. But having seen events unfolding and truths being revealed in recent months, I can't help but have a strong witness in my spirit that the cause of the TTG - Truth, Transparency and Good Governance - will not split the church, by this I mean not only CC but more importantly the local Christian community.
I'm convicted that the cause championed by TTG will make the Church of Jesus Christ in this land even stronger as we soldier on to win this nation for our Lord. And having attended CC for more than 26 years and served full-time for more than 5 years, I'm equally sad that matters have developed to this extent. Nevertheless, I'm prepared to play whatever role necessary in ensuring TRUTH, TRANSPARENCY and GOOD GOVERNANCE, to be upheld not only by CC, but more importantly, by all churches and Christian organisations in this land. This, I believe wholeheartedly, is what our God requires of us all if we are to be His witnesses. Our God is definitely on the side of Truth.
God bless.
November 2, 2008 7:11 PM
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Joseph Gerard said...
Hi Bro Vijay, Very well said.
Though many would be hurt both spiritually and emotionally, but at the end of it all, let Truth, Transparency and Good Governance prevail especially in the church. As the saying goes, "Action speaks louder than words." We've been fighting against corruption, mismanagement of funds etc. for the running of our country. But what more as Christians, as a Church, we should show much greater examples within the church context itself.
I've heard from various individuals that the TTG have actually put CC in particular, and the Church in general, to shame when they started this blog. They questioned why must we wash our dirty linens in public. But I believe probably TTG have been pushed to a corner, and that they have no other choice, but to create this blog, Calvary Today. I would also believe that their intentions were to let the Calvarites know the "behind the scenes" (so to speak) happenings in CC. Kindly correct me if I'm wrong my fellow bros & sis in TTG.
I'm glad to hear from Bro Vijay that there are now some churches 'paying more attention' and calling for more transparency and good governance within their churches after reading this blog. This is the way to go. I pray that the Holy Spirit would continue to guide each and everyone of us in our words and actions. At the end of it all, may Truth & Justice prevail, as our Lord is the Lord of Truth & Just.
"Blessed are the poor in spirit, For theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
Blessed are those who mourn, For they shall be comforted.
Blessed are the meek, For they shall inherit the earth.
Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness, For they shall be filled.
Blessed are the merciful, For they shall obtain mercy.
Blessed are the pure in heart, For they shall see God.
Blessed are the peacemakers, For they shall be called sons of God.
Blessed are those who are persecuted for righteousness' sake,
For theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
Blessed are you when they revile and persecute you,
and say all kinds of evil against you falsely for My sake." (Matt 5:3-11)
God bless.
November 2, 2008 10:02 PM
************************************************************
VIJAY said...
It appears there is indeed a split within the body of Calvary Church, Malaysia and there is urgent need for inner healing. Yet, who can bring forth that inner healing that will bring true union once again. The only one who can do this perfectly is the Head, that is our Lord, Jesus Christ and it is my declaration by faith that He will do this. How and when, only He knows.
From my understanding of the ways of God, the events that took place at Calvary was meant to happen. They are not by chance or because of second course etc. They were permitted for a purpose which only He knows, but it will turn out to be a blessing to many so that the whole body of Christ is blessed.
God always means evil for good as nothing can happen outside His predetermined counsel and foreknowledge. (See Genesis 50:20, Isaiah 10:5, Isaiah 53:10-11, Job 2:3, Job 12:16, Deuteronomy 8:5, John 19:7, Acts 2:23, Acts 4:26, 1Peter 2:21, Romans 8:23, Romans 8:36 and Jeremiah 25: 9-12 & 14. (from the Books "God Means Evil for His Good Purposes" and "God Unlimited" Sylvia Pearce and Norman Grubb)
As a member of the research commission, it is my humble opinion that there is a serious need to educate the congregation of churches in Malaysia on church governance. It appears there is a need for a 101 Church Management and Governance guideline provided to both leaders and members on basic function and duties of the the Board of Directors (BOD)the leadership and the rights of the congregation.
It should cover the selection of the BOD and the conduct of the senior pastor and other leaders, treasury function, internal control and audit, management of projects, the remuneration and welfare of church employees, the daily administration of the church etc.
Such a guideline will enable the leadership and the congregation to benchmark their church against best practise. I shall continue to believe that the Lord will bring together the necessary experts that such a 101 can be timely produced and freely made available so that each Christian can benchmark his/her church to the best practice in church management and governance. I humbly volunteer my services.
The word from my dear friend Sylvia for you and your wounded friends is shared below.
*********************************************************
From Sister Sylvia Pearce
"Any church crisis is an opportunity for God to come in and deliver in some miraculous way or another. Instead of fear, and unbelief, we stand in faith and watch God come through in victory. Many ministers and ministries here in America are misusing God's money in the same fashion as some churches in Malaysia are doing. God's church cannot be built on materialism and greed.
Unknowingly these leaders and ministers are leading God's people into bondage instead of liberation. I think the false teaching of "Prosperity" is corrupting many. God certainly wants to prosper or deliver us out of every crisis, but the devil has twisted true deliverance into the lust for fleshly comforts and pleasures.
The Malaysian church in crisis and confusion needs to understand that it is not ours to try to figure out how God is going to use evil for his good in their situation, because trying to analyze the situation will cause more confusion and take them away from simple faith in God. Like Moses, if they will simply sing their songs of victory, the Lord will show them the way.
Doing the will of God, as the Word says, is to be thankful for all things (I Thes. 5:18). And the power of sacrificial praise is well pleasing to the Lord." "Crisis is always our opportunity and an adventure of faith, Our only real danger in a crisis is that we stay in unbelief, resentment, bitterness, unforgiveness and pride.
Keep your inner eye on Jesus, the author and finisher of our faith, and He will direct our paths. Once we learn God's ways we will have His wisdom on the subject. “Lean not on your own understanding, but in all your ways acknowledge Him and He will direct your paths” God always shakes everything that can be shaken, so that only what is Christ will remain."
"God enabled Moses to overcome many insurmountable difficulties. God called Moses to lead His people out of Egyptian bondage. Moses survived numerous plagues, endured the hostility of his fellow Israelites and faced the vengeance of Pharaoh’s army. How did he endure such hardships?
We are told the secret in Hebrews 11:27: Moses “endured, as seeing Him who is invisible.” He saw through all the stuff to the invisible, yet almighty and ever present God. Moses correctly read the signs. He didn’t go by what He saw, but rather what God said. He got God’s instructions and then followed God’s leading. Therefore God enabled Moses to courageously face opposition, overcome obstacles, and endure hardships."
Sylvia D. Pearce
http://www.theliberatingsecret.org/
Submitted by Vijay
NOTE: THESE ARE MY PERSONAL VIEWS AND NOT NECESSARILY THE VIEWS OF THE NECF, MALAYSIA.
October 28, 2008 8:37 AM
Once again, we wish to express our heartfelt thanks to Bro. Vijay, for his invaluable advice to us, which we appreciate very much. Here is his advice to us to COPYRIGHT the contents in this blog, which was posted as a Comment on November 9, 2008. We have since taken heed to his advice and has therefore included the COPYRIGHT clause in this blog. God is Good.
CT
*****************************************************
Bamboo Conspiracy said...
COPYRIGHT THE KNOWLEDGE CONTENT OF THIS BLOG
It is amazing, as a Christian researcher, I have been searching the Internet for sound case study material on Church Governance but never really found such detailed analysis as I found in this Blog. Here you can find a wealth of case study material on Church Governance on the following topics:
1. Church Organisation Structure
2. Church Constitution
3. Church Administration and Accounting
4. Church Staff Handbook
5. Conduct of Pastoral Staff
6. Truth, Transparency & Accountability
I strongly recommend that the Webmaster copyright all the knowledge content in this Blog to prevent plagiarism. This way anybody using material from this Blog must obtain written permission from the Webmaster before it can be published elsewhere. Furthermore, it will save guard the interest of Calvary Church and prevent people twisting the facts contained here for their own purposes.
I reiterate, this Blog has the potential to become the defector research resource for real life case study on Church Governance and the basis for the publication of 101 on Church Governance. All you mature and discerning bloggers could contribute towards this task as part of the Post Calvary Church gift to God’s Kingdom. I strong belief nobody can publish Best Practices Guideline on Church Governance without consulting this Blog.
In fact, any Church Governance publication that does not refer to this Blog has not done sufficient research and such a book would probably be worthless. Please protect the knowledge content of this Blog immediately.
Dr. Paramsothy Vijayan
www.normangrubb.com
November 9, 2008 7:32 PM
***************************************************
CT & TTG give all PRAISE AND GLORY to our LORD JESUS CHRIST for giving us wisdom and guidance each step of the way since the beginning of this whole saga. We will continue to avail ourselves to our MASTER AND HEAVENLY FATHER, to be obedient and to allow ourselves to be of His service, to see to the fulfillment of HIS WILL AND PURPOSES here on earth. We also like to thank these brothers who have put in their Positive Comments with regards to this Blog.
To the rest of you, whom we have not quoted, we also thank you for your encouraging comments to help us along in this arduous journey. We reiterate our call here to everyone to BLOG RESPONSIBLY with the KINGDOM OF GOD in mind. Let us not be rumour-mongers but be truth-bearers. And do not forget to PRAY because prayer is the key to victory, prayer is the key that unlocks the door for God's intervention into our lives and into our church. PRAYER CHANGES THINGS.
Thank you and God Bless All.
*************************************************************
Bamboo Conspiracy said...
Dear Bro & Sis in Christ.
I am a member of a Christian research commission. I am in deep sorrow in reading of events that has been discussed in the blog regarding an historical church, Calvary Church Malaysia. I too suffer with the church because when a member suffers, the Whole body of Christ suffers with it. I surely don't want to see events that has been mentioned in the blog to happen to any other churches. Furthermore, I also pray that the sole purpose of the blog as mentioned in the purpose and objective statement is strictly maintained. Otherwise, the blog that started positively with clear objectives will lose its perspective and end up in ruin because of comments outside the objective. Those who comment must make sure what they write is within the objective and in the spirit of love, truth and accountability.
THE IMPORTANCE OF THIS BLOG.
As a Christian researcher let me be one of the first to say that, this blog is important - not only to members of Calvary Church but also to others in the Malaysian Christian community. I am all for disclosure in blogs. The blog is after all a neutral tool used for communication. Perhaps the Teh Tarek Group (TTG) never expected this blog to become so important when they first started it and was bold enough to speak the truth in love. As long as what is disclosed is done with the sincere desire to disseminate TRUTH IN LOVE – it will serve its purposes and receive the blessings of the Lord. Furthermore, it also provides a platform for those who are disheartened to express their hurts and feelings - rightly or wrongly.
This blog has done what I have been fighting to do for the past two years - the need for guidelines on Church Governance. There is a lack of transparency in Churches worldwide and in Malaysia. What I had failed to achieve in two years, this blog did within two months! - for the right or wrong reasons! In the past, I have at different occasions called for the need for Church Governance but every time, I was told, "it is a sensitive issue and it is best left for the individual churches to sort out its own internal problems". I kept hitting a stonewall - then came along this blog! It has now become the defector education forum (rightly or wrongly) on church governance and has enabled others to witness firsthand what can happen in a church when there is a lack of transparency, accountability and church governance (perceived or true).
As I said earlier, the blog serves its purpose. This I know because various Christians have approached me from other denomination regarding the issues at Calvary after reading the blog. The happenings in Calvary have become a revelation (rightly or wrongly) and have enabled the members, the BODs and the leaders in other churches to re-examine themselves in the light of events discussed in the blogs and correct any internal flaws that may exist in their present church structure and governance.
Take for example, the CIM Travelling Expenses disclosed in this blog. A cell leader from another church informed that he became very concerned in seeing the CIM Travelling Expenses and reading the blogs and comments. He said, at the next church leaders’ meeting, he is going to advice the church leaders to disclose in detail the church expenses and how it was used to expand God's kingdom. He wanted to make sure that church funds are used not only in travels and attending conferences but also in soul winning.
Similarly, another church member (the treasurer) had informed that he has decided to disclose additional information in the monthly church accounts for greater transparency. These are just two examples I know of how this blog has enlightened (rightly or wrongly) other Christians on the importance of Church Governance, transparency and accountability.
NOTE: I want to congratulate the brother for disclosing his name – that is transparency and accountability. He is willing to take responsibility for disclosing that information in the CIM Travelling Expenses and should be commended. He is willing to be answerable to the truthfulness of the content. This is want I want to see in the blog more and more – accountability.
My one and only concern is the long-term integrity of this blog. The integrity of this blog must be preserved at all cost for the sake of its educational value and the future unity of Calvary Church. Hence, the call for transparency and accountability in all those who blog. Remember, the present problem at Calvary Church WILL be resolved one day - only God knows the timing - but it will happen. THEN STARTS THE HARD WORK of bringing reconciliation, closure and inner healing for all – for there will be those who are hurt in each camp - the ones in support of the TTG and those who may not fully agree with all that the TTG represent (for the right or wrong reasons). Only the Lord knows the outcome.
Our spiritual fathers teach us that God is always of the side of Truth. During the Second World War, Christians in both camps, the Allies and the Axis, prayed but, God is always on the side of Truth and in the providence of God, Hitler was defeated. Then, commence reconciliation and closure.
From what I have heard, there is evidence, the Blog has positively (for the right or wrong reasons) contributed to Christians within and without Calvary Church. Nevertheless, we need to think of the wounded members when in the near future the current issues in Calvary Church are resolved and reconciliation commences.
For this reason alone, this Blog must preserve its integrity and transparency and hence the need for wisdom and spiritual maturity to make sure every comment we make does not return to hound us in the future. An unkind word, a hurtful remark, name calling – once written cannot be retracted. As long as the blog continues to expose SIN in the church and bloggers are willing to be accountable, the blog is on track. Let TRUTH prevail but in LOVE! We cannot run away from TRUTH or FACTS.
I believe that those who display information in the blog are mature and responsible enough to ensure what they report is based on TRUTH and FACT. It is rewarding to see some of the bloggers are willing to disclose their names when financial figures and charts are displayed. That is accountability and transparency.
Vijay
http://www.normangrubb.com/
vijay.newdawn@gmail.com
THESE ARE MY PERSONAL VIEWS AND NOT NECESSARILY THE VIEWS OF THE NECF.
**********************************************************
hm said...
I agree with bamboo conspiracy. We must always maintain our dignity and Christian attributes especially when we are hurt, angry or disappointed. We must not lash out in anger. Others may do so but we must not. Otherwise we would be reduced to their level of unchristian behavior. All my postings are in my name. I have not commented except when asked to respond, again always in my name.
Unfortunately just as I do not seem to be able to influence the BOD or the pastors, I also do not have much influence over the TT members. And I believe most of the extreme comments are not from the TTG because we always remind each other to maintain proper decorum when blogging on this site. The webmaster seems to have removed comments which are deemed unacceptable and I have to trust his/her judgment.
Hong Meng
November 2, 2008 6:36 PM
********************************************************
Winslow said...
Well said, brother Jay.
You are absolutely right in reminding us that the going-ons at CC have become a revelation and have enabled our fellow brothers in other churches to re-examine themselves in the light of events discussed in CT, and hopefully in the process correct any internal flaws that may exist in their church structure and governance.
At times we Christians are afraid to either reveal the truth or see the truth revealed for fear that it will hurt others, and that it will split the local church. Sure, truth does hurt at times, and we are witnessing this in CC, but if we love God and His Church we need to be courageous to go through it, and if need be, bite the bullet, so to say. Even if we come out of this saga wounded, spiritually and emotionally, and hopefully not physically, it's certainly worth it if God's Kingdom is firmly established in our land. God's Mighty Holy Spirit certainly knows how to heal and restore His church.
Initially I was also hesitant to subscribe to the cause of TTG. By the way, there's no membership roll, and all are welcome as there are definitely no PRIVILEGES at all. But one caution though - be prepared for non-stop criticisms by those on the other side of the divide. But having seen events unfolding and truths being revealed in recent months, I can't help but have a strong witness in my spirit that the cause of the TTG - Truth, Transparency and Good Governance - will not split the church, by this I mean not only CC but more importantly the local Christian community.
I'm convicted that the cause championed by TTG will make the Church of Jesus Christ in this land even stronger as we soldier on to win this nation for our Lord. And having attended CC for more than 26 years and served full-time for more than 5 years, I'm equally sad that matters have developed to this extent. Nevertheless, I'm prepared to play whatever role necessary in ensuring TRUTH, TRANSPARENCY and GOOD GOVERNANCE, to be upheld not only by CC, but more importantly, by all churches and Christian organisations in this land. This, I believe wholeheartedly, is what our God requires of us all if we are to be His witnesses. Our God is definitely on the side of Truth.
God bless.
November 2, 2008 7:11 PM
*******************************************************
Joseph Gerard said...
Hi Bro Vijay, Very well said.
Though many would be hurt both spiritually and emotionally, but at the end of it all, let Truth, Transparency and Good Governance prevail especially in the church. As the saying goes, "Action speaks louder than words." We've been fighting against corruption, mismanagement of funds etc. for the running of our country. But what more as Christians, as a Church, we should show much greater examples within the church context itself.
I've heard from various individuals that the TTG have actually put CC in particular, and the Church in general, to shame when they started this blog. They questioned why must we wash our dirty linens in public. But I believe probably TTG have been pushed to a corner, and that they have no other choice, but to create this blog, Calvary Today. I would also believe that their intentions were to let the Calvarites know the "behind the scenes" (so to speak) happenings in CC. Kindly correct me if I'm wrong my fellow bros & sis in TTG.
I'm glad to hear from Bro Vijay that there are now some churches 'paying more attention' and calling for more transparency and good governance within their churches after reading this blog. This is the way to go. I pray that the Holy Spirit would continue to guide each and everyone of us in our words and actions. At the end of it all, may Truth & Justice prevail, as our Lord is the Lord of Truth & Just.
"Blessed are the poor in spirit, For theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
Blessed are those who mourn, For they shall be comforted.
Blessed are the meek, For they shall inherit the earth.
Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness, For they shall be filled.
Blessed are the merciful, For they shall obtain mercy.
Blessed are the pure in heart, For they shall see God.
Blessed are the peacemakers, For they shall be called sons of God.
Blessed are those who are persecuted for righteousness' sake,
For theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
Blessed are you when they revile and persecute you,
and say all kinds of evil against you falsely for My sake." (Matt 5:3-11)
God bless.
November 2, 2008 10:02 PM
************************************************************
VIJAY said...
It appears there is indeed a split within the body of Calvary Church, Malaysia and there is urgent need for inner healing. Yet, who can bring forth that inner healing that will bring true union once again. The only one who can do this perfectly is the Head, that is our Lord, Jesus Christ and it is my declaration by faith that He will do this. How and when, only He knows.
From my understanding of the ways of God, the events that took place at Calvary was meant to happen. They are not by chance or because of second course etc. They were permitted for a purpose which only He knows, but it will turn out to be a blessing to many so that the whole body of Christ is blessed.
God always means evil for good as nothing can happen outside His predetermined counsel and foreknowledge. (See Genesis 50:20, Isaiah 10:5, Isaiah 53:10-11, Job 2:3, Job 12:16, Deuteronomy 8:5, John 19:7, Acts 2:23, Acts 4:26, 1Peter 2:21, Romans 8:23, Romans 8:36 and Jeremiah 25: 9-12 & 14. (from the Books "God Means Evil for His Good Purposes" and "God Unlimited" Sylvia Pearce and Norman Grubb)
As a member of the research commission, it is my humble opinion that there is a serious need to educate the congregation of churches in Malaysia on church governance. It appears there is a need for a 101 Church Management and Governance guideline provided to both leaders and members on basic function and duties of the the Board of Directors (BOD)the leadership and the rights of the congregation.
It should cover the selection of the BOD and the conduct of the senior pastor and other leaders, treasury function, internal control and audit, management of projects, the remuneration and welfare of church employees, the daily administration of the church etc.
Such a guideline will enable the leadership and the congregation to benchmark their church against best practise. I shall continue to believe that the Lord will bring together the necessary experts that such a 101 can be timely produced and freely made available so that each Christian can benchmark his/her church to the best practice in church management and governance. I humbly volunteer my services.
The word from my dear friend Sylvia for you and your wounded friends is shared below.
*********************************************************
From Sister Sylvia Pearce
"Any church crisis is an opportunity for God to come in and deliver in some miraculous way or another. Instead of fear, and unbelief, we stand in faith and watch God come through in victory. Many ministers and ministries here in America are misusing God's money in the same fashion as some churches in Malaysia are doing. God's church cannot be built on materialism and greed.
Unknowingly these leaders and ministers are leading God's people into bondage instead of liberation. I think the false teaching of "Prosperity" is corrupting many. God certainly wants to prosper or deliver us out of every crisis, but the devil has twisted true deliverance into the lust for fleshly comforts and pleasures.
The Malaysian church in crisis and confusion needs to understand that it is not ours to try to figure out how God is going to use evil for his good in their situation, because trying to analyze the situation will cause more confusion and take them away from simple faith in God. Like Moses, if they will simply sing their songs of victory, the Lord will show them the way.
Doing the will of God, as the Word says, is to be thankful for all things (I Thes. 5:18). And the power of sacrificial praise is well pleasing to the Lord." "Crisis is always our opportunity and an adventure of faith, Our only real danger in a crisis is that we stay in unbelief, resentment, bitterness, unforgiveness and pride.
Keep your inner eye on Jesus, the author and finisher of our faith, and He will direct our paths. Once we learn God's ways we will have His wisdom on the subject. “Lean not on your own understanding, but in all your ways acknowledge Him and He will direct your paths” God always shakes everything that can be shaken, so that only what is Christ will remain."
"God enabled Moses to overcome many insurmountable difficulties. God called Moses to lead His people out of Egyptian bondage. Moses survived numerous plagues, endured the hostility of his fellow Israelites and faced the vengeance of Pharaoh’s army. How did he endure such hardships?
We are told the secret in Hebrews 11:27: Moses “endured, as seeing Him who is invisible.” He saw through all the stuff to the invisible, yet almighty and ever present God. Moses correctly read the signs. He didn’t go by what He saw, but rather what God said. He got God’s instructions and then followed God’s leading. Therefore God enabled Moses to courageously face opposition, overcome obstacles, and endure hardships."
Sylvia D. Pearce
http://www.theliberatingsecret.org/
Submitted by Vijay
NOTE: THESE ARE MY PERSONAL VIEWS AND NOT NECESSARILY THE VIEWS OF THE NECF, MALAYSIA.
October 28, 2008 8:37 AM
Tuesday, November 4, 2008
Detailed Account of CIM Travel Expenses
The TTG had a meeting recently and realised that the Chart on " CIM TRAVELLING EXPENSES" posted on 1st November 2008 may have led to some misinterpretation as the Chart actually showed the consolidated amount for travelling expenses incurred from 2002 to 2007.
Since the amounts shown has attracted so much interest among the readers, we feel that it is only proper to show the full details of the Travel Expenses incurred on a yearly basis. This is to avoid any unnecessary speculation and assumption by readers.
We sincerely apologise if the consolidated chart has caused any misunderstandings and misinterpretation to the readers.
Below is the revised Chart prepared by Bro Siew Chyuan. All the figures were extracted from the CIM audited accounts which he has personally viewed together with 3 other TTG members.
CT
***********************************************************
Siew Chyuan said...
For the benefit of all bloggers/readers, I have just re-looked at the CIM audited a/cs (as copied by me) & shared with Bro. Hong Meng (HM). I now realised that in an effort to fit all the figures onto the blog, HM had left out the 5 columns (for the years 2003 to 2007) & shown only the last column which is the total column.
Thus, I wish to clarify to all bloggers/readers that the RM 75,786 spent on USA – Global Pastors Network was actually incurred over 2 years (RM 33,428 in 2005 & RM 42,358 in 2006) & not in 1 year.
Similarly, the figure of RM 37,174 for Korea – Church Growth Int. Conference was spent over 3 years (RM 10,654 in 2005, RM 16,870 in 2006 & RM 9,650 in 2007).
Other than the above mentioned 2 figures, I confirm that all the other figures were incurred in 1 year only, as follows:
From Designated Fund 2007 – RM 15,467 to RM 693,2006 – RM 27,838 to RM 1,328,2005 – RM 16,957 & RM 55,731,2004 – RM 12,986 to RM 3,141, and2003 – RM 1,263 to RM 387 From General Fund2007 – RM 11,521, and2006 – RM 3,330.The total amount of RM 477,625 spent on Meetings & Conferences on a per year basis is as follows:2003 – RM 48,509,2004 – RM 111,259,2005 – RM 116,988,2006 – RM 124,968 and2007 – RM 75,901.
(Click on the CHART to view a larger picture. Click on "BACK" at the top left hand corner, to return to this page)
Btw, as have been mentioned by most bloggers/readers, let’s leave SP’s children & grandchildren out of all this mess – OK?
In His Majesty's Service
Since the amounts shown has attracted so much interest among the readers, we feel that it is only proper to show the full details of the Travel Expenses incurred on a yearly basis. This is to avoid any unnecessary speculation and assumption by readers.
We sincerely apologise if the consolidated chart has caused any misunderstandings and misinterpretation to the readers.
Below is the revised Chart prepared by Bro Siew Chyuan. All the figures were extracted from the CIM audited accounts which he has personally viewed together with 3 other TTG members.
CT
***********************************************************
Siew Chyuan said...
For the benefit of all bloggers/readers, I have just re-looked at the CIM audited a/cs (as copied by me) & shared with Bro. Hong Meng (HM). I now realised that in an effort to fit all the figures onto the blog, HM had left out the 5 columns (for the years 2003 to 2007) & shown only the last column which is the total column.
Thus, I wish to clarify to all bloggers/readers that the RM 75,786 spent on USA – Global Pastors Network was actually incurred over 2 years (RM 33,428 in 2005 & RM 42,358 in 2006) & not in 1 year.
Similarly, the figure of RM 37,174 for Korea – Church Growth Int. Conference was spent over 3 years (RM 10,654 in 2005, RM 16,870 in 2006 & RM 9,650 in 2007).
Other than the above mentioned 2 figures, I confirm that all the other figures were incurred in 1 year only, as follows:
From Designated Fund 2007 – RM 15,467 to RM 693,2006 – RM 27,838 to RM 1,328,2005 – RM 16,957 & RM 55,731,2004 – RM 12,986 to RM 3,141, and2003 – RM 1,263 to RM 387 From General Fund2007 – RM 11,521, and2006 – RM 3,330.The total amount of RM 477,625 spent on Meetings & Conferences on a per year basis is as follows:2003 – RM 48,509,2004 – RM 111,259,2005 – RM 116,988,2006 – RM 124,968 and2007 – RM 75,901.
(Click on the CHART to view a larger picture. Click on "BACK" at the top left hand corner, to return to this page)
Btw, as have been mentioned by most bloggers/readers, let’s leave SP’s children & grandchildren out of all this mess – OK?
In His Majesty's Service
Saturday, November 1, 2008
Post EGM - CIM Traveling Expenses
CIM Travelling Expenses
At the EGM a deacon explained in detail the various expenses paid out from CIM. He emphasized that more than 90% of the expenditures had been to cover the cost of international ministry engagements in line with the charter of CIM “mainly to enable our Senior Pastor and Sister Petrina to preach or minister to the needs of people as part of CIM evangelism ministry.”
Below is a list of their travelling expenses extracted from the audited accounts from inception till year ended 2007.
(Click on the Chart to Enlarge. To return to this page, Click "BACK" on the left hand corner)
For your information.
Hong Meng
6th October 2008
At the EGM a deacon explained in detail the various expenses paid out from CIM. He emphasized that more than 90% of the expenditures had been to cover the cost of international ministry engagements in line with the charter of CIM “mainly to enable our Senior Pastor and Sister Petrina to preach or minister to the needs of people as part of CIM evangelism ministry.”
Below is a list of their travelling expenses extracted from the audited accounts from inception till year ended 2007.
(Click on the Chart to Enlarge. To return to this page, Click "BACK" on the left hand corner)
For your information.
Hong Meng
6th October 2008
